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Man of the People
Post Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:27 pm
Posted by Scarlet Pimpernell on Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:27 pm
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I see the PM is showing his credentials for being classed as the man of the people who understands the troubles they face by having his Christmas Dinner delivered by Harrods and spending New Years Eve on the island of Mustique. This is the home of the rich and famous. I remember Blair was often criticised for his holidays by the right wing press but currently no mention of the double standards.
The Sun appears more interested in trying to rubbish anyone who is considering standing as the new leader rather than commenting on the homeless crisis for example. I wonder why start so early because it is five years before it is put back to the public unless they believe Labour supporters will take any notice of their selection.
Re: Man of the People
Post Tue Dec 24, 2019 4:31 pm
Posted by wrencat1873 on Tue Dec 24, 2019 4:31 pm
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He never was and never will be a man of the people but, on the back of Brexit and "taking back control" many of the people in the North of England seem to have been taken in.
Labour needs to start getting it's act together and be ready for 5 years time - assuming that the Tories make it to the end of a fixed term period - for the first time.
Boris is a very privileged man and will never have any true empathy for many of those who have just voted for him - mind you, that's not Boris's fault.
Labour MUST find a centre left leader and forget the hard left Corbyn/ Foot style, it will NEVER be popular enough among the masses - NEVER.
Re: Man of the People
Post Tue Dec 24, 2019 4:43 pm
Posted by sally cinnamon on Tue Dec 24, 2019 4:43 pm
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It does amuse me when various Labour figureheads are popping up now saying "we need to come out of our metropolitan bubble and start really listening to the communities that we lost" and then in the next breath say "the next Labour leader has to be a woman and has to be someone whose constituency is outside London".

Have they come to this conclusion from people on the doorstep in northern/midland constituencies saying "I can't vote for Boris, I want a woman who is located out of London" or has it just come from talking to people in the Labour metropolitan bubble.
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Re: Man of the People
Post Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:00 pm
Posted by Cronus on Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:00 pm
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Scarlet Pimpernell wrote:
I see the PM is showing his credentials for being classed as the man of the people who understands the troubles they face by having his Christmas Dinner delivered by Harrods and spending New Years Eve on the island of Mustique. This is the home of the rich and famous. I remember Blair was often criticised for his holidays by the right wing press but currently no mention of the double standards.
The Sun appears more interested in trying to rubbish anyone who is considering standing as the new leader rather than commenting on the homeless crisis for example. I wonder why start so early because it is five years before it is put back to the public unless they believe Labour supporters will take any notice of their selection.

:lol:

Yep you're right, the PM should be in a massive queue at Aldi frantically chucking his budget turkey, spuds and booze in an array of old plastic bags, before legging it to Bargain Booze half an hour before closing in a panic because 48 cans of Carling, 4 bottles of £2 Prosecco, 8 bottles of £4 wine, 8 litres of White Lightning and 4 bottles of a generic "London" gin might not be enough for the next 2 days because the in-laws are coming over and we all know they take the p[ss.

You're just displaying envy, which is not an attractive trait, but very common on the left. He has money, let him spend it and his time as he sees fit. Who made you arbiter of acceptable destinations or food providers? I understand perfectly well how someone can have money troubles, I certainly did when I started out - that doesn't mean I'm going to live like that in solidarity. No, I'm going to enjoy the fact I can spend a bit on the decent things in life.

IIRC, Blair was criticised for not declaring a conflict of interest for at least one holiday, and for staying with Berlusconi on a couple of occasions(?) - at a property that was later seized in a corruption enquiry? Something like that anyway. I may have some of that wrong but there were certainly questions surrounding his hosts.

Anyway have you SEEN the Labour possibles? If any of them get in you've got a decade of Boris in power - and if he does a good job you can kiss Labour goodbye for a generation. I don't read the Sun but I imagine they - like the rest of us - are killing themselves laughing at the calibre of the candidates, as well as the excuses, apologies and almost blanket lack of understanding coming from Labour leadership.

Never mind, I'm sure Stormzy can turn the tide. :lol:
Re: Man of the People
Post Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:19 pm
Posted by King Street Cat on Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:19 pm
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While I can envisage a decade of Tory rule, I don't think it will be a decade of Johnson rule. If he even makes it through this first 5 years, I'll bare my backside in Harrods window.
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Re: Man of the People
Post Wed Dec 25, 2019 9:09 pm
Posted by IR80 on Wed Dec 25, 2019 9:09 pm
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King Street Cat wrote:
While I can envisage a decade of Tory rule, I don't think it will be a decade of Johnson rule. If he even makes it through this first 5 years, I'll bare my backside in Harrods window.

You better start hitch-hiking now, do you even know where Harrods is?
Re: Man of the People
Post Thu Dec 26, 2019 1:23 pm
Posted by King Street Cat on Thu Dec 26, 2019 1:23 pm
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IR80 wrote:
You better start hitch-hiking now, do you even know where Harrods is?


I like to go there to see if I can see my hero, Tim Martin, spending his millions.
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Re: Man of the People
Post Thu Dec 26, 2019 2:42 pm
Posted by sally cinnamon on Thu Dec 26, 2019 2:42 pm
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King Street Cat wrote:
While I can envisage a decade of Tory rule, I don't think it will be a decade of Johnson rule. If he even makes it through this first 5 years, I'll bare my backside in Harrods window.


Johnson is more secure at this point because there isn't an obvious alternate leader around.

When Cameron was there, the obvious contenders for the succession were Osborne and Johnson. Theresa May benefited from Osborne's departure and the sabotage of Johnson's campaign by Gove, but from then on there was always a brooding Johnson waiting for his moment.

When you have that kind of contender with future ambitions, they aren't a threat to the existing PM as long as their ambitions have a timescale that doesn't clash with the existing PM and they feel the existing PM is giving them sufficient promotion and opportunity to build their power base (eg Osborne for Cameron, or Brown in the early days with Blair). Once the wannabe leader feels their time is due, they cluster allies around them who start briefing against the PM and causing mischief (Brown later on; Johnson).

At the moment I think Johnson is in the fortunate position that his coronation has seen off the rivals of his own generation. The old guard like Fox, Gove, Davis, Hunt are not going to be leader now. It's likely that the next leader of the Tory party will be from the next generation, who at this point will be looking to put in their loyal service for a few years. Someone like Rishi Sunak might be a favourite pet of Johnson, willing to do the work, turn up for the tough interviews that Johnson doesn't fancy doing, but who won't be a short-term threat.

But there will be trouble down the road. William Hague has a quote like: "the Tory party is always loyal to its leader....until its not". It has a record of discipline much better than Labour's, until there's a sniff of weakness in the leader and the vultures circle. Even Thatcher became insecure once the Tories started to lose by elections in safe heartlands and with an election 18 months away many Tory MPs started to look nervously at their own seats and be susceptible to the argument 'if only we had a new leader, we might get away with our jobs'. That example might show the potential end for Johnson - the impacts of Brexit are likely to hit the north/midlands industrial base (what's left of it) disproportionately harder than the services-based south. There are a lot of Tory MPs in those areas now with smallish majorities and if the economy goes bad they will be nervous.

Johnson is an enthusiast for history and so he will have seen the way rulers of the past have met various sticky ends. I think he may be different from Thatcher and Blair in that I don't know if he has the drive in him to go on and on past his sell by date as leader. Those two were driven by having a vision of how the country should be and wanted to remake it in that way, which made them cling to power. Being PM probably just appeals to Johnson's vanity in the way being President appeals to Trump. It's something he has always wanted to 'do' but I think he will get tired of the pressure and complexity of office sooner than Thatcher and Blair did. I also think Johnson likes the idea of being an important/popular figure in public life more than just squatting in Downing Street. He might look at Churchill and MacMillan and how they became seen as national treasures in their later life, and look at Blair now trying to have his say on various issues and being treated with scorn, and think he'd rather be a Churchill or MacMillan.
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Re: Man of the People
Post Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:55 pm
Posted by wigginswarrior on Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:55 pm
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Silly me, this being a rugby forum, I thought it was about Anthony Gelling :lol:
Re: Man of the People
Post Sat Dec 28, 2019 2:34 pm
Posted by Biff Tannen on Sat Dec 28, 2019 2:34 pm
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wrencat1873 wrote:
He never was and never will be a man of the people but, on the back of Brexit and "taking back control" many of the people in the North of England seem to have been taken in.
Labour needs to start getting it's act together and be ready for 5 years time - assuming that the Tories make it to the end of a fixed term period - for the first time.


Looking at the names banded as possible leaders of the Labour party moving forward Labour will do well to not fall even deeper into the mire never mind overturning the tories majority in 5 years time.
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