Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:55 am  

hengirl wrote:

I'd be amazed if Lam doesn't get the job for next season to be honest,Terrible today again I just dont see what his "style" brings to the table..maybe it is in part the squad of players he has but lets be fair this is beyond losing Tomkins etc now, the side look bereft of ideas, its time to either ship Lam out of say he's the boss for next season, this is getting silly now its time IL and KR grow a pair and name him, then let the cards fall where they may.

I agree for the most part, we look so so poor. I just don't see what Lam has done to earn the position long term.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:07 am  

hengirl wrote:

I'd be amazed if Lam doesn't get the job for next season to be honest,Terrible today again I just dont see what his "style" brings to the table..maybe it is in part the squad of players he has but lets be fair this is beyond losing Tomkins etc now, the side look bereft of ideas, its time to either ship Lam out of say he's the boss for next season, this is getting silly now its time IL and KR grow a pair and name him, then let the cards fall where they may.

Maybe the situation is that he was given a certain amount of time to prove himself?

The year Millward got sacked, in mid-June we were adrift at the bottom of the table by about 4 clear points. Millward was already gone by them of course, but there'd clearly been no option but to get rid. Under Lam we are 8th, with 14 points in the bank, which many clubs would deem acceptable. I know that isn't good enough for Wigan, and the results are not the whole story - we have indeed been utterly dire. But we could still make the play-offs, and if that was the deal with Lam, the club may want to honour it.

It's also the case that hiring and firing coaches in knee-jerk is a risky business. Noble, who came in mid-season at a cost of £1 million, or so the rumour held, saved us from what had looked like certain relegation, but didn't take us the extra mile to start winning stuff. That was Maguire, whose recruitment took nearly a year. There may be an argument that finding the right man to coach this very poor team will take a fair bit of time.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:12 am  

Cruncher wrote:

Maybe the situation is that he was given a certain amount of time to prove himself?

The year Millward got sacked, in mid-June we were adrift at the bottom of the table by about 4 clear points. Millward was already gone by them of course, but there'd clearly been no option but to get rid. Under Lam we are 8th, with 14 points in the bank, which many clubs would deem acceptable. I know that isn't good enough for Wigan, and the results are not the whole story - we have indeed been utterly dire. But we could still make the play-offs, and if that was the deal with Lam, the club may want to honour it.

It's also the case that hiring and firing coaches in knee-jerk is a risky business. Noble, who came in mid-season at a cost of £1 million, or so the rumour held, saved us from what had looked like certain relegation, but didn't take us the extra mile to start winning stuff. That was Maguire, whose recruitment took nearly a year. There may be an argument that finding the right man to coach this very poor team will take a fair bit of time.

At this stage in the season, considering how we play, considering how far plays have fallen in their game I genuinely think enough time has passed to make a fair call on Lam.
I actually think it would be interesting to see how Wigan play and respond over the course of the rest of the season without Lam. Do they lift now he's gone? Or... are they really that poor.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:18 am  

Last Son of Wigan wrote:

At this stage in the season, considering how we play, considering how far plays have fallen in their game I genuinely think enough time has passed to make a fair call on Lam.
I actually think it would be interesting to see how Wigan play and respond over the course of the rest of the season without Lam. Do they lift now he's gone? Or... are they really that poor.

I'd agree that if the problem is that the coach's relationship with the team has malfunctioned then someone has to go.

There are a number of players in this team, though, who I think we'd all agree are more of a hindrance than a help. Most of them are in the forwards, while there are several of the backs who just seem to want to leave. Unlike 2006, there isn't a very good team waiting to come out. So, it may take a much more widesweeping changes than simply axing the coach.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:29 am  

Cruncher wrote:

I'd agree that if the problem is that the coach's relationship with the team has malfunctioned then someone has to go.

There are a number of players in this team, though, who I think we'd all agree are more of a hindrance than a help. Most of them are in the forwards, while there are several of the backs who just seem to want to leave. Unlike 2006, there isn't a very good team waiting to come out. So, it may take a much more widesweeping changes than simply axing the coach.

I'd say this team is much better than the of 2006 before the arrival of Fielden and Dobson. We're only 3 players different from going unbeaten in the playoffs and winning the GF. I don't see the team of 2006 doing that.

I think Bateman and Tomkins were massive for us, but not so important to see us go from the best team in the comp to this cr%p.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:37 am  

moto748 wrote:

So couldn't Lockers do more? Surely the silence on the pitch suggests the senior pros don't back Lam?

That’s how it looks. The only player I saw giving anyone a gee up yesterday was Smithies as we were packing down for scrums. It says a lot about the kid but even more about the rest of the side.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:12 am  

Last Son of Wigan wrote:

I'd say this team is much better than the of 2006 before the arrival of Fielden and Dobson. We're only 3 players different from going unbeaten in the playoffs and winning the GF. I don't see the team of 2006 doing that.

I think Bateman and Tomkins were massive for us, but not so important to see us go from the best team in the comp to this cr%p.

At least back then we had some half decent forwards in Logan, Fletcher, Feka (For 10mins) and Seuseu is prob better than Tautai.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:28 am  

post wrote:

At least back then we had some half decent forwards in Logan, Fletcher, Feka (For 10mins) and Seuseu is prob better than Tautai.

Still, that team isn't a patch on this., well, it shouldn't be.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:52 am  

Last Son of Wigan wrote:

I'd say this team is much better than the of 2006 before the arrival of Fielden and Dobson. We're only 3 players different from going unbeaten in the playoffs and winning the GF. I don't see the team of 2006 doing that.

I think Bateman and Tomkins were massive for us, but not so important to see us go from the best team in the comp to this cr%p.

I honestly believe that, using my own Crunch Test (A - world class, B - good, C - journeyman, D - substandard, E - useless, get rid), at present we only have 5 B-standard players (all with caveats): Williams, who is leaving, Gildart, who may be leaving, Zak, who needs to find form soon or he'll be downgraded, Budgie, who's only staying for one more year, and Faz (when he's not injured). It goes without saying that we have no A-standard players at all.

Those statuses can change, but there isn't much sign of it at present.

Re: Team for HKR : Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:56 am  

With the injuries we have had I'm not sure how often Lam has been able to name his best 17 or how often he has managed to name the same 17 as the previous week. Back in 2016 and 2017 when we had an injury crisis we were poor. 2016 we rallied to the title, 2017 we were awful even with our best players back so it is hardly unknown territory in terms of losing games.

Personally, I would like to see Lam given a shot but as head coach he needs to have full control over signings, back room staff etc which as an interim I don't think he would have had this season.