Widnes Al wrote:
I take it you never saw Ian Botham? His 149 at Headingly in 1981 was off 148 balls against Australia whos attack included the likes of Dennis Lillee and Geoff Lawson! A match winning innings without a doubt along with the 7 or 8 wickets he also took in the game! Pieterson was a great batsman but in terms of match winners can't be mentioned in the same breath as Botham! And Botham was English of course!
Funnily enough I was at Headingley as a 7 year old with my dad in 81. Of course Bothams' knock at Headingley is one of the best ever by an England player and the one he did at Old Trafford was an excellent knock as well, as he himself has said ,Headingley was a bit of a slog that gradually turned into something, whereas the one at OT was far better quality innings.. He was a great player between 1977 and 1982 and then declined badly. Lets not forget that headingley was as much about the bowling of Bob Willis, who's 8-43 was probably more impressive imo, considering the circumstance of the Aussies needing only 130.
The fact he never produced anything against the best attack of that time the WI's can't be overlooked, he averages 15 with that bat and 32 with ball.
Anyway as far as KP, I've followed England around the world for nearly 30 years and imo he's easily the most exciting player I've seen, let alone he's a great player who played great innings.
Innings like the first one that set his career off, smashing Warne, McGrath, Brett Lee etc around like an U13 team scoring 158 (187)
Not long after against Sri Lanka and a bowler named Muralitharan made our team look like they'd never played before but KP came in and smashed 142(157) we only scored 295 as a team and that won us the match.
His vicious 225 (308) in Aus helped us win the 2nd test in 2010.
After England lost every test in the UAE and were 1-0 down in SL, he produced another spectacular knock on an absolute spinning dust bowl scoring 151 (165) winning us the match.
The 1st test against India to become the No.1 team in the world he smashed 202 no to win., then in the 4th test he smashed another 175 to win again.
Like I mentioned before his 149 against an attack of Steyn, Philander, Morkel, Kallis, Imran Tahir was as brutal as I've seen.
Then imo the best innings played by an England player abroad was that 186(222) on a rank turner when we were 1-0 down in a country we haven't won in decades, that led to us turning the series around and winning.
The inning that beats KP's best was Gooch's 154 no against WI. What made it great wasn't just because it was England's first win in years or because the ball was swinging around corners; it was because England had been bowled out for 198 but then WI replied with only 173, so Goochie went to work in the 2nd inning scoring 154 and no other player scored over 27 to post 252. Oh aye did I mention he was facing Marshall, Ambrose, Walsh & Patterson, now that's frightening. We went on to draw that series 2-2 as well against the great West Indies.
As far as Gooch being underrated, personally I think he's seen as one of England's best but if he is underrated it's probably because for the first 15 years of his career he only averaged 36 in 73 tests and was an inconsistent batsmen who got regularly dropped. He also got banned for three years following a rebel tour to ostracized South Africa in the early 80's, which some hold against him. He averaged 51 in his last 5 years which was from being about 36 to 42 years old. He almost had the opposite career to Botham, great at the end, average at the start, Botham was great at the start and average to poor after that.
Damn that turned into a long reply, but was replying to 2 posters there.
Teah England were 500-1 and they put a bet on for a laugh.
