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Re: New SKY sports deal Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:04 pm  
Ornery Optimist Bronze RLFANS Member
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Donnyman wrote:
I'm afraid it is. Richard Lewis was highly vocal about the fact that to raise Rugby leagues profile we needed more top class international games. Therefore Catalans were invited into Superleague so they could give leading French players a pathway to professionalism and the French national side. The year after their inclusion France.v.Great Britain tests re-started accordingly.

And no Catalans were not burdened with an instruction to be the French national side, only create a pathway for quality French RL players and aspiring young French players to reach the top. French players were just as welcome to go to St.Helens like Theo Farges did - quite a number of French lads have played in English sides.

in 2006 Casty, Fellous, Mouinis, Rinaldi, Guisset, Frasayinous, Fakir, Bosc, Verges and Fellous Etc were regulars in the side.

But Gausch had no interest in the French National side and as the years went by the French side suffered and the GB.v.France tests were pulled.

That only spurred Gausch on to abandon any idea of growing French Pro-RL and creating a pathway for youngsters. He had run an academy but shut that down, and progressively he brought in English and Antipodean players in order to try to win himself cups, which he did with the Wembley final win.

Buoyed by this he presided over a policy that didn't encourage French players anymore. gigot left, Maria and Simon were not played much. Albert and Morgue who were promising players didn't play at all towards the end of this season and French players like Seguire ,were sat on the bench for the full duration of games.

What point there ever was to Catalans has disappeared....... Expansion they are not......



I cannot find any quote from Richard Lewis similar to your assertion.Could you assist,please?

He did seem to want to expand the sport;as did Mick Potter.

https://www.therhinos.co.uk/2009/02/05/ ... er-league/


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... 300343.stm


No mention of the international improvement/involvement/development...responsibility for one club side...
No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.
Re: New SKY sports deal Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:47 pm  

User avataratomic wrote:
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Yet the product still exists and is able to generate income. Good for the product. But the demise in the sport without a sugar daddy is looking considerably weaker.
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Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:37 am  

Donnyman wrote:
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Ornery Optimist wrote:
I cannot find any quote from Richard Lewis


You mean you don't want to find anything about Catalans being brought in to develop the French International side :D

"In 2005, UTC applied to join the Super League, the highest tier of professional rugby league in Europe. They were selected ahead of Toulouse Olympique and Villeneuve Leopards to enter the league for the 2006 season. The franchise was named Catalans Dragons; UTC remained in the French Championship to serve as a reserve club. The club set a target for 75% of the players be qualified to play for France."

This is straight from Catalans own club history as published on the internet :lol:
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 10:23 am  
Ornery Optimist Bronze RLFANS Member
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Donnyman wrote:
You mean you don't want to find anything about Catalans being brought in to develop the French International side :D

"In 2005, UTC applied to join the Super League, the highest tier of professional rugby league in Europe. They were selected ahead of Toulouse Olympique and Villeneuve Leopards to enter the league for the 2006 season. The franchise was named Catalans Dragons; UTC remained in the French Championship to serve as a reserve club. The club set a target for 75% of the players be qualified to play for France."

This is straight from Catalans own club history as published on the internet :lol:



Right.So the club set their own target.No condition(s) set by the governing body on the parachuting into Super League.Ergo,no breach of any condition, or responsibility for the failure by the French governing body to appoint a decent head coach for the international side.
They can't even be blamed for the failings of one individual in Toronto.
Time for your focus to shift to New York and/or Ottawa.
PS - Newcastle Thunder have set a target of winning Super League by 2030.Should this fail to materialise, no overseas situated club is to blame.
No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 11:40 am  

User avatarwrencat1873 wrote:
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Donnyman wrote:
You mean you don't want to find anything about Catalans being brought in to develop the French International side :D

"In 2005, UTC applied to join the Super League, the highest tier of professional rugby league in Europe. They were selected ahead of Toulouse Olympique and Villeneuve Leopards to enter the league for the 2006 season. The franchise was named Catalans Dragons; UTC remained in the French Championship to serve as a reserve club. The club set a target for 75% of the players be qualified to play for France."

This is straight from Catalans own club history as published on the internet :lol:


They (Catalan) set "a target" of 75%.
Ok you're right lets kick 'em out :CRAZY:

You love to blame Catalan (and Toronto) plus any other overseas clubs for the sport's failings over here.
It's time to look a lot closer to home.

The greed of the top clubs plus the inability of the sport to attract new fans and hang on to it's existing ones is the reason and I think you actually know this.
The game is also dying due to a lack of international profile.
I'm sure you can also remember the "promises" to build on the "success" of the last 2 world cups.

The total lack of support for International RL from Australia almost killed the international game off.
IIRC, Richard Lewis was instrumental in getting this moving again, with the 4 Nations and a return to a regular world cup.

Our international game is based around having 3 decent national sides, plus the recent emergence of Tonga but, so much of the international game is contrived through relaxed qualifying player criteria and the regular "flip flopping" of players, who change nationality with alarming regularity.

France is at least a genuine RL playing Nation, albeit with RL played in a small South West enclave but, lets kick their clubs out of any elite competition and consign them to amateur RL - yay

We should be finding ways to grow the game both in the UK and abroad and stop being so bloody insular.

Or, we could just bemoan the fact that the sport's profile gets ever smaller and that "we" cannot command a decent TV deal, something that is unlikely to increase in the foreseeable and wont happen until RL is deemed either a proper National or International sport.
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:48 pm  

Donnyman wrote:
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Ornery Optimist wrote:
Right.So the club set their own target .


If you say so :lol: :lol: :lol:
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:59 pm  

Donnyman wrote:
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wrencat1873 wrote:

:shock: You love to blame Catalan (and Toronto) plus any other overseas clubs for the sport's failings over here.
It's time to look a lot closer to home.



Once again it's not about me is it? It's really rather simple. Expansion requires new paying TV deals and player development. That's not my definition it is both Eric Perez's and Superleagues.

Expansion is not placing clubs in SL an expanded distance from the others and at the same time kicking out an English SL club?:

But some people think it is, remember when they all got excited by the idea of Perth (WA) coming into SL. Imagine if that happened and Wakefield Trinity were relegated so they could take their SL place, and Trinity shut their academy and Wakefield fans cancelled their SKY subs???

Now would you call that "expansion" of the professional game? if you would please explain it to me :D
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:16 pm  

User avatarwrencat1873 wrote:
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Donnyman wrote:
Once again it's not about me is it? It's really rather simple. Expansion requires new paying TV deals and player development. That's not my definition it is Superleagues.

Expansion is not placing clubs in SL an expanded distance from the others and at the same time kicking out an English SL club?:

But some people think it is, remember when they all got excited by the idea of Perth (WA) coming into SL. Imagine if that happened and Wakefield Trinity were relegated so they could take their SL place, and Trinity shut their academy and Wakefield fans cancelled their SKY subs???

Now would you call that "expansion" of the professional game? if you would please explain it to me :D


Perth would be ludicrous but, let's not go there.

I actually agree with your point about not kicking out English clubs just to accommodate a newbie.
However, there should always be a plan to grow the game, if not, by very definition, we're going backwards and this has been lacking for decades.
However, even IF Catalan were replaced by an English club in SL, this would represent yet another failure by the sport of Rugby League and our past is absolutely littered with those.
There has to be a decent strategy to grow the game, increase interest, increase participation and IF we can be successful with that, increased TV revenue would come hand in hand with that success.

I dont see ANY plan for those things, do you ? and the game is currently dyeing slowly
Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 4:01 pm  
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There's always room for expansion in our game, as it is so small and played in such a small area any expansion is good. Even Toronto (which failed business wise) still managed to showcase our game to an extra 9,000 people who otherwise would never have played or watched RL. Even if 10 of those start following RL it's better than none. However expansion should be done right and build from the bottom.

Toronto was basically a a 'bought' entity. At least Catalans have produced players, played before SL inclusion as UTC and continue to have a steady support larger than some SL clubs. Toulouse have done it right, they have produced players, earned their stripes in the Championship and on the surface of it run a good business. Newcastle and York are the next two who are doing expansion right. Building from the bottom up. Good amateur game, good development and plying their trade at a lower level first.

If any of these teams were to go, especially Catalans, it would be such a bad look for the game. I'm all for strong heartlands clubs, without them, the game dies. But in order to grow and prosper as a sport we need to introduce it to new markets, new people and keep building outside the M62 corridor.
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Re: New SKY sports deal Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:53 pm  

Donnyman wrote:
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Bulls Boy 2011 wrote:

Toronto was basically a a 'bought' entity. At least Catalans have produced players, played before SL inclusion as UTC and continue to have a steady support larger than some SL clubs. Toulouse have done it right, they have produced players, earned their stripes in the Championship and on the surface of it run a good business. If any of these teams were to go, especially Catalans, it would be such a bad look for the game. I'm all for strong heartlands clubs, without them, the game dies. But in order to grow and prosper as a sport we need to introduce it to new markets, new people and keep building outside the M62 corridor.


The French game produced the players.

Catalans job was to take the best on and give them a professional arena to develop further in, and a path to annual competitive test matches with England to develop into International quality players. Certainly Catalans did play senior French players and ran an academy to further develop junior French players.

But year on year England would hammer the French International side (a dozen times with an average score of 52-7) and Gausch seemed to lose any interest he had. The academy was shut, the Internationals abandoned and now we have a situation where Catalans first choice team no longer has any French lads in the first team with Casty gone and Yaha out of favour.

I know you say that removing them from SL would be a "bad look", but the fact is Toronto were chucked out recently and it doesn't seem to me anyone beyond the RL fans who crave "expansion" actually gave a monkeys. Catalans aren't much of a draw here either when it comes to the bulk of fans so I can't see anyone crying if an English club took their place.

But it's not the fans shout. It's Superleague chairmen's shout and most of them don't like Gausch.
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