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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:03 pm
Posted by IR80 on Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:03 pm
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The Ghost of '99 wrote:
Yes, at the next election. HTH.

That wouldn't be changing a result, it will be a new vote and it will end up with a coalition, led by the Conservatives.
Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:22 pm
Posted by Mild Rover on Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:22 pm
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IR80 wrote:
Could we reverse a General Election result - no. It is as simple as that.


I wasn’t talking about changing the result. I was starting from the point of accepting Brexit, but that my view on what Brexit should look like should still be as valid and relevant as anybody else’s, despite my having voted Remain, and could even be part of a more viable coalition that relying on the unicorn wing of the Brexit alliance.

If I don’t vote for the party that wins an election, I can still have an opinion on their policies. ‘You lost, shut up’, is not how it either should or does work.
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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:17 pm
Posted by Sal Paradise on Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:17 pm
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If/when we have another referendum if the result comes out remain by 3-4% I guarantee we will not be subject to all these shennanigens to get the result overturned. The MPs are terrified we might vote for no deal so they are not prepared to even give us that option.

A second referendum will only work if its no deal or remain - then nobody can suggest they didn't know what they are voting for. It cannot be two versions of remain.

Immigration played a big part in the last referendum - it doesn't appear to be anywhere near the issue it was - this election is about who ultimately controls the way we run the country. Is it our elected MPs or is it the European Council a bunch of unelected bureaucrats.
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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:55 pm
Posted by The Ghost of '99 on Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:55 pm
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Sal Paradise wrote:
If/when we have another referendum if the result comes out remain by 3-4% I guarantee we will not be subject to all these shennanigens to get the result overturned. The MPs are terrified we might vote for no deal so they are not prepared to even give us that option.
.
No deal is the fever dream of the hard right (and those who have gambled against the pound, typically some of the same folk). I'd have no problem with it being on a referendum ballot because there is no chance it would get a majority.
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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:57 am
Posted by Sal Paradise on Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:57 am
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The Ghost of '99 wrote:
No deal is the fever dream of the hard right (and those who have gambled against the pound, typically some of the same folk). I'd have no problem with it being on a referendum ballot because there is no chance it would get a majority.


It all hyperbole as it will never happened we will simply be presented with two versions of remain.
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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 9:19 am
Posted by IR80 on Sun Oct 13, 2019 9:19 am
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Sal Paradise wrote:
It all hyperbole as it will never happened we will simply be presented with two versions of remain.

Labour have pretty much said they will vote down any agreement Johnson gets, such is their quality as a political party.
Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 9:59 am
Posted by wrencat1873 on Sun Oct 13, 2019 9:59 am
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IR80 wrote:
Labour have pretty much said they will vote down any agreement Johnson gets, such is their quality as a political party.


Maybe they fundamentally disagree with the deal that Johnson is trying to secure.
After all, Labours plan was to have "a customs union", which whilst not satisfying those on the right of the Tory party, it would eliminate the issues in Ireland and allow a free trade deal with the EU :IDEA:
Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:06 am
Posted by Sal Paradise on Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:06 am
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wrencat1873 wrote:
Maybe they fundamentally disagree with the deal that Johnson is trying to secure.
After all, Labours plan was to have "a customs union", which whilst not satisfying those on the right of the Tory party, it would eliminate the issues in Ireland and allow a free trade deal with the EU :IDEA:


Labour's plan was to remain and present an option so similar as to make remaining an easier choice. Staying in a customs union and the single market and adopting all the EU labour rules is remaining - Labour's 6 red lines were impossible to achieve they knew it all along. To say Labour wanted a deal in b0ll0cks.
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Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:44 am
Posted by Cronus on Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:44 am
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wrencat1873 wrote:
Maybe they fundamentally disagree with the deal that Johnson is trying to secure.
After all, Labours plan was to have "a customs union", which whilst not satisfying those on the right of the Tory party, it would eliminate the issues in Ireland and allow a free trade deal with the EU :IDEA:

I wonder...if the EU refuse an extension (or the idiotic Benn bill is somehow circumnavigated) and the only options are Johnson's deal or no deal - what will Labour do? :EH:

I suspect if Corbyn/McDonnell try to whip them into opposing the deal we'll see enough rebels to get it through.
Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4)
Post Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:12 am
Posted by IR80 on Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:12 am
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wrencat1873 wrote:
Maybe they fundamentally disagree with the deal that Johnson is trying to secure.
After all, Labours plan was to have "a customs union", which whilst not satisfying those on the right of the Tory party, it would eliminate the issues in Ireland and allow a free trade deal with the EU :IDEA:

or maybe they are so hatefull and spitefull of Johnson they can't accept what the electorate voted for.
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