Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Wed Nov 19, 2014 10:29 am  

deslawson wrote:

We had a star number 7 in danny brough,who was told by mcnamra in world cup year,that he wouldnt be picking him.So as it was probably his last chance to play in the world cup he trotted off to captain scotland,and has done a great job wouldn't you say and bearing in mind he was man of steel in the world cup year 2013.

Not just McNamara though, is it? The British game has hardly been overrun with world class halves yet none of the top clubs has gone out of its way to sign Brough (unless you count Hudds as a serious title contender). And every time the important games come around I can see exactly why that is.

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Wed Nov 19, 2014 4:42 pm  

Developing half backs is a luxury SL clubs cannot afford. The squad system with the salary cap IMO limits the chances for half backs to be developed. The skills, experience and temperament of halves needs nurturing and takes time and opportunity to play senior (adult) rugby but at the very least train with your club. Farming out halves to lower division clubs or rivals on loan or dual registration seldom works out long term.
Every club half back should have someone pushing them from the reserves, but that is rare these days. Clubs can't afford it. So, when you do get injuries at top clubs you end up with something like Jon Wilkin or Kevin Sinfield (loose forwards) playing 7, rather than a reserve half getting 1st team experience.

Still, our only genuine 7 plays hooker so WTF do I know?

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:29 am  

DHM wrote:

Developing half backs is a luxury SL clubs cannot afford. The squad system with the salary cap IMO limits the chances for half backs to be developed. The skills, experience and temperament of halves needs nurturing and takes time and opportunity to play senior (adult) rugby but at the very least train with your club. Farming out halves to lower division clubs or rivals on loan or dual registration seldom works out long term.
Every club half back should have someone pushing them from the reserves, but that is rare these days. Clubs can't afford it. So, when you do get injuries at top clubs you end up with something like Jon Wilkin or Kevin Sinfield (loose forwards) playing 7, rather than a reserve half getting 1st team experience.

Still, our only genuine 7 plays hooker so WTF do I know?

Are we saying that the only half backs that will be playing in SL will be rejected players from the NRL?

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 10:54 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Are we saying that the only half backs that will be playing in SL will be rejected players from the NRL?

Not the only ones, but don't they already form a fairly high percentage?

The majority of SL clubs have at least one Antipodean half-back in their best 13, from memory. Can only think of Warrington, Leeds and Cas that didn't in 2013.

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 12:51 pm  

Widnes, Huddersfield?

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 12:53 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Are we saying that the only half backs that will be playing in SL will be rejected players from the NRL?

Leeds haven't produced a single half back to SL level in 10 years. Nobody has been pushing McGuire, Burrow and Sinfield and nobody has gone to another club from our juniors and made the grade.

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:01 pm  

DHM wrote:

Leeds haven't produced a single half back to SL level in 10 years. Nobody has been pushing McGuire, Burrow and Sinfield and nobody has gone to another club from our juniors and made the grade.

If you look around SL there are very few half backs produced at any club that would have challenged those three.

Perhaps the talent simply doesn't exist or the will isn't there to persist. If Leeds had produced a really top young half back would the culture have allowed him to replace the captain - not a chance, so why would the club waste the resource. Its a catch 22 - it is no surprise all these youngsters emerged at a time the club was struggling financially. Perhaps now Leeds desperately need some talent in the halves one will emerge as the best youngsters can see an opportunity

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:09 pm  

DHM wrote:

Leeds haven't produced a single half back to SL level in 10 years. Nobody has been pushing McGuire, Burrow and Sinfield and nobody has gone to another club from our juniors and made the grade.

There was an interview on this with Sinners on Rugby AM the other night on the new 'Leeds TV' channel. He was saying along the lines that players in that position tend to be moved around by their clubs and not developed solely in that specialised role.

One thing I am unsure of though - not having any channels other than free-view I don't know how old the episodes of Rugby AM are that the Leeds channel is showing.

My impression is that they are from around Aug / Sept - there was one with Koukash on last night mentioning a horse race event he was going to go to at some point in September - so he is either very organised or they are episodes that are several months old!

Can anyone say how far 'behind the times' I am in seeing those episodes of Rugby AM?

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:21 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

If you look around SL there are very few half backs produced at any club that would have challenged those three.

Perhaps the talent simply doesn't exist or the will isn't there to persist. If Leeds had produced a really top young half back would the culture have allowed him to replace the captain - not a chance, so why would the club waste the resource. Its a catch 22 - it is no surprise all these youngsters emerged at a time the club was struggling financially. Perhaps now Leeds desperately need some talent in the halves one will emerge as the best youngsters can see an opportunity

I agree with a lot of that, and that ties back into my original point about incentives to develop new half backs under the squad system, competition structure and cap that we have now. But for a club like Leeds to not produce anyone in 10 years who could either go on to secure a SL career at another club or challenge McGuire or Burrow at some level is an indication something isn't right. I don't buy the argument that the opportunity isn't there for kids in the Leeds academy. They should be looking at their career, and being picked up and developed by the No.1 club SL over the last decade is a great start on your CV. Other clubs would not be put off because a kid can't get a game infront of Danny McGuire or Kevin Sinfield. Maybe it's an attitude thing, but if it is then I'm surprised those kids get anywhere beyond playing for their school with that approach.

Re: McNamara - Is it time for him to go? : Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:21 pm  

DHM wrote:

Leeds haven't produced a single half back to SL level in 10 years. Nobody has been pushing McGuire, Burrow and Sinfield and nobody has gone to another club from our juniors and made the grade.

Luke Gale possibly. But I agree the quality of half backs is woeful.