[Bullseye]

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:13 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Maguire gets the very best out of the Burgess brothers - they play a style that suits them. England don't have the team to do that. As a result they both looked very ordinary to me. They will have to up their game significantly if they are to have the impact we need them to have to win on Saturday.

Under estimate Australia at your peril, this is still a team of high quality players that if they gel will cause England some issues.

The Burgess twins look good in the Souths pack because that pack is better than the England pack. Not so much the style as the individuals in it.

I think all the team will have to up their game and I don’t think anyone is under-estimating the Aussies.

They’ll be up for this game as losing would be an embarrassment.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:13 pm  

Souths pack had S Burgess and Ben Teo helping the other two Burgess brothers. But more importantly for me had Isaac Luke directing them. Throw Roby/McLlorum and O'Loughlin into that pack and we look a lot stronger.

In saying that I thought George looked good as usual against Samoa but wasn't at his absolute best. Tom is still abit more inconsistent but has the size we need IMO.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:29 pm  

DP_wwrlfc wrote:

Souths pack had S Burgess and Ben Teo helping the other two Burgess brothers. But more importantly for me had Isaac Luke directing them. Throw Roby/McLlorum and O'Loughlin into that pack and we look a lot stronger.

In saying that I thought George looked good as usual against Samoa but wasn't at his absolute best. Tom is still abit more inconsistent but has the size we need IMO.

I'd love to have seen an England pack including Sam Burgess, Roby, a fully fit Lockers and a mentally stable Gaz Hock this Sunday! If we'd have had that I think I'd be going in to a game against Australia for the first time in my lifetime expecting to win.

There's an awful lot on James Graham and a potentially half fit Lockers on Sunday. The Burgess twins are dangerous but they don't have that aura about them just yet.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 7:46 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

I'd love to have seen an England pack including Sam Burgess, Roby, a fully fit Lockers and a mentally stable Gaz Hock this Sunday! If we'd have had that I think I'd be going in to a game against Australia for the first time in my lifetime expecting to win.

There's an awful lot on James Graham and a potentially half fit Lockers on Sunday. The Burgess twins are dangerous but they don't have that aura about them just yet.

IMO we'll be fielding the weakest pack we have for some years.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:08 pm  

Dally wrote:

IMO we'll be fielding the weakest pack we have for some years.

I picked NZ to win by 12 as a result of their dominance up front and the Aussies tiring in the last 25 minutes as a result. The reality was that the Aussies actually tired visibly from about the 45th minute......if the English pack can dominate them AND IF THE AUSSIES HAVEN'T BLOWN ENGLAND AWAY INSIDE 25 MINUTES, then I can see England winning this game and keeping the Aussies out of their first major final since 1954.

Given that it would have been expected for Samoa, New Zealand and England all to bring big packs to this tournament, the decision by the Aussies to not try to counter this with their own monsters does seem strange......but as I have said elsewhere, write them off at your peril.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:22 pm  

gutterfax wrote:

I picked NZ to win by 12 as a result of their dominance up front and the Aussies tiring in the last 25 minutes as a result. The reality was that the Aussies actually tired visibly from about the 45th minute......if the English pack can dominate them AND IF THE AUSSIES HAVEN'T BLOWN ENGLAND AWAY INSIDE 25 MINUTES, then I can see England winning this game and keeping the Aussies out of their first major final since 1954.

Given that it would have been expected for Samoa, New Zealand and England all to bring big packs to this tournament, the decision by the Aussies to not try to counter this with their own monsters does seem strange......but as I have said elsewhere, write them off at your peril.

Oz by more than 20.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:30 pm  

I think this game and Tournement will turn out to be a nightmare for Australia, they'll throw it all at England on Sunday and lose, leaving them with a dead rubber against Samoa.

Australia will not take England on down the middle, they'll go wide early and kick long often which will play into the hands of Watkins, Hall, Tomkins and Charnley.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:22 pm  

The Avenger wrote:

I think this game and Tournement will turn out to be a nightmare for Australia, they'll throw it all at England on Sunday and lose, leaving them with a dead rubber against Samoa.

Australia will not take England on down the middle, they'll go wide early and kick long often which will play into the hands of Watkins, Hall, Tomkins and Charnley.

I think they'll use a superior, quicker back riw and backline to destroy us. Assuming he plays, GI to score a hat-trick.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:47 pm  

Dally wrote:

I think they'll use a superior, quicker back riw and backline to destroy us. Assuming he plays, GI to score a hat-trick.

I have Australia to win by 14 points, based on England's defensive line speed being poor v Samoa and the mobility of the Australian back row. I believe they will base a lot of their possession on either good tactical kicking (hugging the touchline and chasing well) or constant use of GI entering the line.
That said, I'd not be stunned to see the English Pack literally rampage through the middle.......as I said, the first 25 minutes are what England need to survive to have a chance.

Re: England vs Samoa: do or dire! : Mon Oct 27, 2014 11:04 pm  

England's defensive line speed was poor in the second half against Samoa, because they'd taken so much petrol out of the tank turning the ball over in the first half.

IIRC didn't England have to defend something like eight more sets than the opposition? Cut that out, and you'll have more energy to defend with.

What's the status on Cherry-Evans? Hopefully he plays, because he doesn't scare me with the ball in hand and frankly he's a walking gap in the defensive line that you can aim your forwards at all day.