Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:04 pm  

tigertot wrote:

And you base that on what? Shenton's more tries (x2), more assists, more metres per carry, more clean breaks, less errors? Or the fact Sarginson plays for Wigan?

I base this on Sarginson getting better throughout the year and from what I saw of Shenton deteriorating. In the play-offs and a few games before Sarginson was making 150m + a game. Him and Burgess formed a dangerous partnership down the left.

To begin with I was less than impressed with Sarginson. In all honesty I didn't think he had a future at centre and would have to try and get into the Wigan team at FB. His defensive reads where all over the show and he never looked for his wing man. But he's made me eat my words. His defence is aggressive, he makes quick decisions and doesn't give the opposition time on the ball. As I mentioned him and Burgess created a great partnership outplaying there opposite numbers throughout the playoffs and one of them or both scored every game.

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:31 pm  

Wigan28/Leeds18 Andy wrote:

You clearly don't remember as none of that happened either.

Apparently it's you who doesn't remember, especially since you're now claiming to be including the CC.

Wigan28/Leeds18 Andy wrote:

The stats include CC games. HTH.

Nothing to be touchy about.

You made a ridiculous comment that was clearly wrong to try and prove your view about where Tomkins should play. The stats prove it. You should have picked something else.

You forgot to add "end of"

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:36 pm  

Is SOL still injured?

Well done Steve McNamara, you genius, for giving the England captaincy to someone who's spent less time on the pitch in the last 2 years than the Wigan water carriers.

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:38 pm  

Sarginson isn't quite ready IMO. He's a good pick to be in and around the squad though as he really started to fulfil his potential at the back end of the year.

If he keeps developing like he has done in his time at Wigan so far he could become a very good player indeed. His hunger for work is second to none with him coming close to 200m per game in the last few games of the season. I've heard a few question his defence but he's been rock solid IMO(at the back end of the year especially). His downfall early in the year was that he didn't seem able to put his winger in to space and was a bit ball greedy but again at the back end of the year he'd formed a great partnership with Burgess and was picking when to pass and when to run perfectly.

This time next year he could well be a starter for England IMO.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:41 pm  

richardviking wrote:

The professionals are all wrong and have been for several years then.

Indeed. That double GF winning coach Michael Maguire clealry didn't have a clue moving Tomkins to fullback.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:42 pm  

loiner81 wrote:

Apparently it's you who doesn't remember, especially since you're now claiming to be including the CC.

I've never said they didn't include the CC - you did. You were wrong - again.

The clue was there for you when I even mentioned Tomkins wins INCLUDE the CC Final win.

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:50 pm  

I thought Smith did ok, and whilst personally I'd have gone with Tomkins & Widdop in the halves, if Smith & Widdop are who we've chosen and who we've trained with then, bar an injury doubt, I wouldn't change them. We need some consistency.

In fact the only change I'd make at all would be to bring in O'Loughlin if he's fit.

melman wrote:

Pace is everything at RL

I agree.

Regards,
Kevin Penny & Dwain Chambers

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:55 pm  

Wigan28/Leeds18 Andy wrote:

I've never said they didn't include the CC - you did. You were wrong - again.

The clue was there for you when I even mentioned Tomkins wins INCLUDE the CC Final win.

Well then, and to quote you, yourself...

"You clearly don't remember"

Not sure why you're getting so wound up anyway. I've already said he'd be in my first 13 every time but, again, not at full back.

Let's see how Saturday goes.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:06 pm  

loiner81 wrote:

Well then, and to quote you, yourself...

"You clearly don't remember"

Not sure why you're getting so wound up anyway. I've already said he'd be in my first 13 every time but, again, not at full back.

Let's see how Saturday goes.

I've no need to get wound up. You said something it was easy to prove was wrong but don't seem able to accept it.

Just to put this to bed, not only were you wrong to say:

Apart from Kevin Sinfield and Leeds, who loved ST playing full back for Wigan

But the complete opposite is true.

Leeds win % v Wigan when Tomkins played fullback = 25%

Leeds win % v Wigan when Tomkins didn't play fullback = 66%

Leeds win % v Wigan after Tomkins moved to fullback but didn't play because he was injured = 100%

Tomkins hasn't played in the halves for 4.5 years. Sunday v Australia in Melbourne is not the time to see if he's better there.

Re: England vs Australia: do or almost die. : Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:14 pm  

Nice stats, how many of those were play off or CC games?

You forgot to quote....

loiner81 wrote:

I do remember him more or less gifting us a CC match and a play off game by making some pretty embarrassing clangers at full back.

Not too dissimilar to what he did at the weekend actually.

Feel free to carry on pretending those games never happened, i'm off to watch Gotham & The Blacklist.
I'll be back Sunday to either apologise or take the mick big time!

Either way I hope we're celebrating a historic win.