Re: Pre Season : Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:06 am  

ComeOnYouUll wrote:

Unfortunately I think yet another home derby friendly is almost certain.

Would be so much better to just have 2 derbies this year, regular fixtures.

Re: Pre Season : Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:14 pm  

If FC are to play KR in an friendly wonder if the game will be at the KC on boxing day

Re: Pre Season : Sun Sep 28, 2014 3:57 pm  

If we do play Donny can they take cash on the gates or will we need to get there the night before for a ticket?

Re: Pre Season : Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:32 pm  

Mrs Barista wrote:

I think we are agreeing.

I was just making it clear what I felt is the benefit of friendlies as your post made it sound like you weren't sure what benefit it gave us.
I understand the worry about getting injuries in friendlies, however I think some of that is down to pre-season training and how intense (or not) it is. And some injuries are just unfortunate and occur in bizarre circumstances.
That said, I think the benefit of warm weather training is just hocum, it's an excuse for a jolly and despite what clubs might say there is nothing benefical over and above training at home. Okay you might have a 'bonding' type scenario but that should be down to the management to sort out at all point throughout a season, to ensure morale is kept up in the face of defeats. You also don't need to swan off to Lazarote or wherever to achieve this..plecebo effect maybe but I think it distracts more than builds on pre-season.

After last season the players deserve a royal kick up the booty until they prove to the coaching staff AND as importantly the fans that they are wanting to be 100% professional (AT ALL TIMES) and prepared to put in 100% effort every single week not when it suits them.
This attitude sets the tone for the whole season, it should flow throughout the whole club from the likes of Radford & Gaz Ellis all the way down to the juniors, at present the ethos I expect from a professional outfit just isn't there.

it's the failure of stuff like this why we are so far behind, players get off from doing what is required to win, partly down to them and partly down to the fact we don't have the right people on the coaching/advising level. At the moment I've no confidence in the coach that he knows what it takes to win & be able to pinpoint finite aspects that need looking at. I certainly don't feel he has the skillset and yes personal feelings aside I just don't think he is the man for the job to be able to see every detail, like friendlies and the pre-season to take us close to winning silverware..

he should take some tips from the likes of team Sky, their preparation for cycle races throughout the whole year is immense, as I said, marginal gains are what seperates winning from losing..Wigan are a great example of this.

Re: Pre Season : Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:09 am  

knockersbumpMKII wrote:

he should take some tips from the likes of team Sky, their preparation for cycle races throughout the whole year is immense, as I said, marginal gains are what seperates winning from losing..Wigan are a great example of this.

Who have their team members training in.............? Tenerife

Re: Pre Season : Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:14 pm  

I'd like to see us have 2 friendlies only. (One in London would be great) and only use the 24 first team players who are most likely to feature next season. Have the spine 1, 6, 7, 9, 13 play at least 60 minutes in each game.
If the 19s need games then fix friendlies for them. They should be playing the same system as the first team, so if they are needed in mid season they can slot in. That's how Saints survive with so many injuries year after year.
My only other wish is no derby.
Pre season last year IMHO from afar was poor and set the tone for the season. Damaging defeats which continued into the season. Players hung out to dry and the finer points like goal kicking (as has been alluded to previously) completely ignored. I maintain a decent kicker may have won us one or two extra games at crucial times this season. That would have provided confidence boosting morale and may have led to a half decent season. The sight of Richard whiting kicking with a carefree attitude stunk and may well have affected him as well.
If we get the off season right then we can hit the ground running and who knows what effect that will have on the whole club in what will be a very important year for the club.

Re: Pre Season : Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:34 pm  

Large Paws wrote:

Who have their team members training in.............? Tenerife

I'm talking about the minute detail they go into.
There's a world's difference from pro cyclists whose competition season is primarily warm/hot weather conditions (aside from the odd day or five of rain & unlucky days of snow on the Giro D'italia) and a team of rugby players preparing for essentially a cold/wet winter weather start to the season in the North of England.

We should be looking at specifics like wet and/or cold ball training to replicate matches where those conditions apply and learn how to overcome the slippery ball, adapting tactics in anticipation of games that might have those conditions.

I mean looking at the sky just before kick-off is probably all that we do instead of looking at the weather forcast seeing it's likely going to rain or be really cold and use a strategy that makes use of the weather and puts the pressure on the opposition to spill the ball.

As we know cold weather effects extremities, we need to ensure hands especially are looked at in terms of keeping them warm & protected so dropped ball is negated as far as is possible and any other aspect that effects player performance (& indeed the ball) due to the conditions.
It's only of recent years that rugby has brought in sports science knowledge to the fore.
Do we have a sports scientist that we can call on/advise the club? If not, why not. Do we send our players off for testing with regard to improving all aspects of their physical performance & well being during the off season and during it too. Do we have a nutrition specialist, do we ensure that players aren't taking the mickey with alcohol, do we do daily alcohol and drug testing etc, especially in a down week or when a player is rehabilitating from an injury.
Is there anyone looking at how other sports treat injuries, even animal injury treatments that aid/speed up recovery..basically there are a million and one things that can be done to make you better, even if some of them seem trivial, they all add up. if you have even an iota of understanding of what it takes to be winner then you look at all avenues instead of the retrograde outlook we have and it shows in our performances more often than not.

Re: Pre Season : Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:59 pm  

knockersbumpMKII wrote:

I was just making it clear what I felt is the benefit of friendlies as your post made it sound like you weren't sure what benefit it gave us.
I understand the worry about getting injuries in friendlies, however I think some of that is down to pre-season training and how intense (or not) it is. And some injuries are just unfortunate and occur in bizarre circumstances.
That said, I think the benefit of warm weather training is just hocum, it's an excuse for a jolly and despite what clubs might say there is nothing benefical over and above training at home. Okay you might have a 'bonding' type scenario but that should be down to the management to sort out at all point throughout a season, to ensure morale is kept up in the face of defeats. You also don't need to swan off to Lazarote or wherever to achieve this..plecebo effect maybe but I think it distracts more than builds on pre-season.

After last season the players deserve a royal kick up the booty until they prove to the coaching staff AND as importantly the fans that they are wanting to be 100% professional (AT ALL TIMES) and prepared to put in 100% effort every single week not when it suits them.
This attitude sets the tone for the whole season, it should flow throughout the whole club from the likes of Radford & Gaz Ellis all the way down to the juniors, at present the ethos I expect from a professional outfit just isn't there.

it's the failure of stuff like this why we are so far behind, players get off from doing what is required to win, partly down to them and partly down to the fact we don't have the right people on the coaching/advising level. At the moment I've no confidence in the coach that he knows what it takes to win & be able to pinpoint finite aspects that need looking at. I certainly don't feel he has the skillset and yes personal feelings aside I just don't think he is the man for the job to be able to see every detail, like friendlies and the pre-season to take us close to winning silverware..

he should take some tips from the likes of team Sky, their preparation for cycle races throughout the whole year is immense, as I said, marginal gains are what seperates winning from losing..Wigan are a great example of this.

I understand why you feel the players shouldn't be rewarded for failure , why they need a kick up the backside etc but in fact from the man management point of view and the psychology it's much more about who's doing the managing and how than where you're doing it. Radders apparently came in to rule with a rod of iron after Gentle's softly softly approach but it didn't have any effect. This is a disparate bunch of individuals , some of whom did well last year , some didn't , some weren't involved and are new and some are still maturing. There are Aussies , locals , experienced and inexperienced players with a real cross section of personalities. If Tenerife gives more daylight hours in a warm climate which helps the sports scientists and physios to keep the players fit and helps with bonding then I can't see it does any harm. How each individual player is handled whilst out there and before reporting for pre season , during the friendlies , socially , publicly and privately will have a much bigger effect. Success depends on the skills or otherwise of the management group as you quite rightly say.

Re: Pre Season : Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:29 am  

I know more about man management than Lee Radford would ever do in several lifetimes, not giving them a jolly out to the seaside abroad is hardly ruling with an iron rod and nor would I suggest doing so in any case. balance of course but giving out candy for being naughty or not doing your chores is just a crazy way to go about bringing up your kids.
As I said, you can do the bonding thing and still give a 'reward' on home turf, it's less disruptive, it's less costly and it doesn't give the impression that the fans are cash cows for players whom are already being paid quite well to have a fair few days abroad with little if any benefit (aside from the usual PR nonsense spouted to justify it) . afterall it is at our expense which frankly given their performances would stick in the craw for me.

As for Gentle I think he was onto a loser from the off, fighting a battle he was never going to win and having Radford as his 2IC was a huge mistake. Gentle wasn't one of the lads, his methods and his way of thinking just too much of a stretch for a club with a mindset still stuck in the 70s.
He 'stupidly' expected grown adults to follow a plan/methods and to be 'professional' about it whilst giving them some latitude because if he hadn't being the outsider he was onto a hiding to nothing anyways. That he got us to two 6th place finishes and a Wembley after the Agar debacle was nothing short of a miracle IMO. However Gentle's methodology clearly didn't sit well with some including Radford.

The pressure of playing pro sport is not really any different to other working environments that have aspirations of being successful & having to work under pressure to achieve that success. You work hard, perform well and you get rewarded. You should expect to be supported & given all the tools necessary plus a set of firm instructions/policies to work with. You communicate and input, it seems that rugby players (especially at our club) are far different and like to set their own rules that sit outside of what I would deem to be professional. The club as a whole has a long long way to go, it misses so much it isn't funny (some of which I've pointed out already) and frankly we won't get anywhere with Pearson & Radford at the helm I'm afraid.
Niether of them are qualified enough to do what we actually need to be successful, Pearson is pretty much bipolar, well more on the mania side if I'm honest and well Radford is just clueless.

Re: Pre Season : Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:34 am  

Fewer friendlies next year apparently.

Donny away, Rovers at home plus possibly one more.

Really not keen on another derby friendly so will definitely be giving that one a miss.