Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:47 am  

tony1983 wrote:

Your whole post is based on an opinion that Cas MIGHT have done X, Y, Z so Leeds should have put the game to bed sooner. The gameplan was not to let Cas do X, Y or Z and it worked to perfection. Thus rendering any other possible outcomes irrelevant.

You are welcome to your opinion. I'm off to watch my team show off the trophy.

Ah you're a Leeds fan. I understand why you're on the defensive. You see criticism where there isn't any.. Quick to jump at anything you see as negative.
No point in arguing that point discussed any longer.
As said in my pointless first post which is void in your eyes. Well done on the win

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:53 am  

Fair to point out it wasn't all negative on the last.
Briscoe's try came from a repeat set after Clark couldn't take hold of a McGuire grubber through.
McGuire's try came from a kick up targeting the full back.
Hall's first try was actually on the last tackle.
Hall's second came from a repeat set after we forced a drop out with a good kick through.

Get what people are saying about "could've" put the game to bed earlier IF we'd tried more. But when we met Cas the last time we tried forcing the ball near their line when we had a 6 point lead and knocked on and Dorn made a break on the free play and him and Sinfield became "involved" and we all remember what happened there.

I think it shows a confidence in your defence. We control how you start your sets and we back ourselves to stop you. We're happy and calm enough to defend a tight lead. This particular group have been in more tight big games than I can remember and how they manage the 2nd 40 minutes is nearly always spot on.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:56 am  

Clearwing wrote:

Cas were never really in it. IMO of course. Yes, they got within six points for a while but during that time they were struggling to hammer away at the half way line, let alone the try line.

You are right. Cas were nervous and leeds defended well too. I just think that it could of been a higher than a 6 point margin if they'd of shown abit more aggression on the last play. Forcing a goal line drop out or bombing the ball for Dorn who was shaky for most of the game.
6 points is 6 points. Any team could even fluke a try to level it up.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:57 am  

Wildmoose wrote:

Leeds tactics weren't as boring as listening to Jonathan Davies.

He has as much insight as a rock to go with his charisma. Why must we suffer him?

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:15 am  

AntGiant wrote:

You are right. Cas were nervous and leeds defended well too. I just think that it could of been a higher than a 6 point margin if they'd of shown abit more aggression on the last play. Forcing a goal line drop out or bombing the ball for Dorn who was shaky for most of the game.

It might have worked out that way. Conversely, Cas might have fielded the ball and launched counter-attacks in broken play - one of their strengths.

AntGiant wrote:

6 points is 6 points. Any team could even fluke a try to level it up.

If allowed to play the game on their own terms, Leeds know that they don't need to be flamboyant to win. Even if Cas had managed to level it, Leeds have been in similar situations in previous finals, have stuck to their game plan and won. Purely hypothetical but I doubt they were ever going to go into panic mode.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:34 pm  

AntGiant wrote:

Ah you're a Leeds fan. I understand why you're on the defensive. You see criticism where there isn't any.. Quick to jump at anything you see as negative.
No point in arguing that point discussed any longer.
As said in my pointless first post which is void in your eyes. Well done on the win

And you aren't a Leeds fan, that much was glaringly obvious. 'No point in arguing' - roughly translated as you don't have one.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:46 pm  

tony1983 wrote:

And you aren't a Leeds fan, that much was glaringly obvious. 'No point in arguing' - roughly translated as you don't have one.

I'm not no, but I've nothing at all against Leeds. One of the top 4 teams I actually would rather see win the likes of saints, Wigan and Wire.
I don't see how it was obvious. You are just being glaringly defensive over nothing.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:33 pm  

AntGiant wrote:

I'm not no, but I've nothing at all against Leeds. One of the top 4 teams I actually would rather see win the likes of saints, Wigan and Wire.
I don't see how it was obvious. You are just being glaringly defensive over nothing.

I get where you and some of the others are coming from. Whether the wording of "negative" is the most precise word is neither here or there really as we get the jist.

But Finals, in most sports aren't usually the arena where the best most exciting play happens. The tactics from Leeds worked well....arguably better than they could've predicted and Cas did end up for the taking at times. Do you then switch from Plan A? It's obvious to switch from it when it's not working, but on this occasion it was working just fine....so arguably the biggest risk would be to alter players mindsets mid match when not overally needed.

I debated with a Warrington fan a few weeks ago who said that if Wire played the 1st half as well as the 2nd 40 they'd have won. I pointed out that a key factor in how that 2nd half played out was because Leeds played in knowledge of a constant 2/3 score lead and was about controlling the game not finishing it off thus we set our stall out accordingly that second 40.

Settling for and controlling a narrow lead or going for the throat and killing the opposition off both have their own risks. It's whatever you feel most comfortable with and what suits the players your particular club has. Leeds have the players that have gone down the final stretch enough times in big games to know what they're doing. Also as pointed out many times the squad has some age to it in certain areas so a more controlled game benefits them. The league game a few weeks back was a really open affair and we started to struggle the more open it came especially around the ruck. Also got to to consider the size of the pitch the final is played on, it's a big pitch that can become even bigger if your defence isn't set and solid.

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 7:11 pm  

ThePrinter wrote:

I get where you and some of the others are coming from. Whether the wording of "negative" is the most precise word is neither here or there really as we get the jist.

But Finals, in most sports aren't usually the arena where the best most exciting play happens. The tactics from Leeds worked well....arguably better than they could've predicted and Cas did end up for the taking at times. Do you then switch from Plan A? It's obvious to switch from it when it's not working, but on this occasion it was working just fine....so arguably the biggest risk would be to alter players mindsets mid match when not overally needed.

I debated with a Warrington fan a few weeks ago who said that if Wire played the 1st half as well as the 2nd 40 they'd have won. I pointed out that a key factor in how that 2nd half played out was because Leeds played in knowledge of a constant 2/3 score lead and was about controlling the game not finishing it off thus we set our stall out accordingly that second 40.

Settling for and controlling a narrow lead or going for the throat and killing the opposition off both have their own risks. It's whatever you feel most comfortable with and what suits the players your particular club has. Leeds have the players that have gone down the final stretch enough times in big games to know what they're doing. Also as pointed out many times the squad has some age to it in certain areas so a more controlled game benefits them. The league game a few weeks back was a really open affair and we started to struggle the more open it came especially around the ruck. Also got to to consider the size of the pitch the final is played on, it's a big pitch that can become even bigger if your defence isn't set and solid.

I hope I didn't use the word negative because if I did it was a mistake.
I also thought the danger was for Leeds. If Cas had come back at them.. Leeds would of had to have come away from plan A. It would of been harder later in the game for them to change there plan.

Warrington are a class at keeping the ball alive and can destroy teams. Leeds first half against them was one of the best first halfs I've seen in a RL game in a long time.
Almost perfect...

Re: Leeds tactics : Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:43 pm  

I don't understand the debate; Leeds were in absolute control for all but 10-15 minutes of that game - they had a plan, executed it brilliantly and Cas were never really in the race, despite the 6 point margin that stood for a while.

Not the most exciting game, but ruthlessly efficient from Leeds - their big game experience and star players showed their class and they got a pretty straightforward win; mission accomplished.