Re: Unsackable Mac : Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:31 pm  

tvoc wrote:

A coach with any pride would have walked after Friday's shambolic performance against a team who let's face it are basically a collection of everyone else's cast-offs including several of Leeds' own - one which Leeds have destroyed twice previously this season.

Leeds lost 18-14 away to Wakefield in the last couple of minutes. Warrington have just lost 26-40 at home to Wakefield. If your above comments are consistent can you confirm that you believe that Tony Smith should now walk too?

Also you never did confirm the list of average coaches so we can all understand better why you believe Brian McDermott to be below average.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:45 pm  

Juan Cornetto wrote:

Leeds lost 18-14 away to Wakefield in the last couple of minutes. Warrington have just lost 26-40 at home to Wakefield. If your above comments are consistent can you confirm that you believe that Tony Smith should now walk too?

As I haven't seen the Warrington V Wakefield match I'm not really in a position to have an informed opinion on the Warrington performance that day.

Juan Cornetto wrote:

Also you never did confirm the list of average coaches so we can all understand better why you believe Brian McDermott to be below average.

Was I asked to?

Not sure I recollect the context of the 'below average' comment so perhaps you'd care to direct me to it first.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:33 am  

Juan Cornetto wrote:

Nobody who is fully employed would have the time to make so many posts as some do during working hours. Are you suggesting these regular posters are moonlighting when they should be working?

Is the fact that Leeds are 2nd in the table and in the Cup semi and you no longer a regular poster just a coincidence then?

Err, isn't moonlighting a second job? If people are being paid to post on here, I want me a piece of that action.

And what are you counting as "working hours"? I am (more than) fully employed. My work does not always happen between 9am and 5pm Monday to Friday.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:54 am  

tvoc wrote:

As I haven't seen the Warrington V Wakefield match I'm not really in a position to have an informed opinion on the Warrington performance that day..

I assume you did see the Wakefield v Leeds match then as you judged the Leeds players mistakes and poor form to be the fault of the Leeds coach and that he should resign as a result. So what specifically was it that you eye witnessed in the Leeds game that led you to deliver your comment on McDermott that couldn't be made against Smith because you didn't see the Warrington game?

tvoc wrote:

Was I asked to?

Not sure I recollect the context of the 'below average' comment so perhaps you'd care to direct me to it first.

You were asked to provide a list of above average coaches to justify your claim that BM is "distinctly average"

"How predictable that having kept your negative head down for the first half of the season you should pop up when the team have lost form and lost players to injury. And how typical that you blame the coach for all our ills.

It was nice of you to share with us the dressing room pre-match team talk, I have to say I am surprised Big Mac let you in. If you regard our head coach as "distinctly average" it would be helpful in understanding what success in your opinion do you have to achieve to become above average? and which other SL coaches have achieved this rating during the three three years that BM has been our head coach?"
I do not recall Brian McDermott taking the field at any stage against last Friday. The "shambolic performance", as you call it, was made by the players. Are you suggesting that any of these same players who have pride should also "walk"?

Perhaps your could share the benefit of your proud coaching experience and explain how an above average coach can overcome key player lack of form and injuries?"

You may have used the words "distinctly average" but in the context of your other comments (see below) rather indicated you were making out a case that he is below average

tvoc

McDermott took a London side that in the ten SL seasons prior to his arrival had averaged a 6.7 league table finish and after four full seasons in charge left them in 13th having averaged 10.5

tvoc

What agenda? McDermott is IMO a very poor coach whose teams put in largely sub-standard collective performances relying almost entirely on individual efforts. As in all walks of life you get what you pay for.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sat Aug 02, 2014 12:17 am  

Juan Cornetto wrote:

I assume you did see the Wakefield v Leeds match then as you judged the Leeds players mistakes and poor form to be the fault of the Leeds coach and that he should resign as a result. So what specifically was it that you eye witnessed in the Leeds game that led you to deliver your comment on McDermott that couldn't be made against Smith because you didn't see the Warrington game?

My post after the shambles at Wakefield can be found on page 3 of this thread. The opening sentiment expressed there could have been repeated tonight as Leeds lost at home to an already relegated team for the 1st time since ..... ? And not just at Wakefield and tonight either but almost on a weekly basis since the Magic weekend.

I still cannot comment on a Warrington performance I did not see, did Tony Smith give some last minute boxing instructions to his most volatile player and smile broadly before his post match interview ?

The injury excuse you appear so fond of repeating at every opportunity is a all too predictable occupational hazard and one that needs to be overcome by the top clubs with the best squads and aren't Leeds fans always being told how this is their 'bestest ever assembled' or some such marketing inspired spin. Are Leeds really ever more afflicted than any other club in SL? Were Leeds more depleted when losing to St Helens in Round 7 ? When losing to Wigan in Round 13 ? When losing to Wakefield in Round 19 ?

Juan Cornetto wrote:

You were asked to provide a list of above average coaches to justify your claim that BM is "distinctly average"

You may have used the words "distinctly average" but in the context of your other comments (see below) rather indicated you were making out a case that he is below average

McDermott is as 'distinctly average' as his 1st grade coaching career suggests he is - how else would you describe a close to 50:50 return. As Leeds are one of the very best resourced clubs in SL why do they entrust the critical role in terms of on field performance to someone who struggles to add any value, someone who IMO will shortly be about as relevant to the modern game as his original mentor who at least still has some currency with the BBC.

McDermott arrived at Leeds promising flamboyant, attractive attacking rugby without being too concerned with completion rates. He's only consistently achieved the latter despite still having a quality group of rather talented players - when he's not turning them into 'nutters.' What's it going to be like in two years time if he's still in charge?

As long as McDermott fits the CEO's primary requirement (and as long as the turnstiles keep clicking) he'll no doubt cling-on but the standard overall is declining when it needs to improve and where is the throughput from the Academy these last four seasons? The majority of those promoted to 1st grade have failed to live up to any reputation they'd gathered along the way while Wigan's in particular look a quality apart but perhaps that's still a continuing legacy of employing a quality coach in 2010.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:25 am  

Can't argue with that tvoc, it's spot on.

Until he can show he can win something with his own team, there will always be questions about it. Did't realise his record was 50/50. That's a poor record for a top team, especially one that was so dominant for so long.

Even John Kear won a couple of trophies, and with two different clubs. There is more to being a coach, some get lucky with good players.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:30 am  

We've been poor for a number of weeks but that is possibly the worst rhinos performance I have seen.

However we will gladly see the real rhinos next week. Do That and we will put ourselves in a pretty decent place to do what no other Leeds coach has done in a decade and a half.

The team needs to be judged on the games which matter not the ones that don't

Is frustrating, especually when I've made a special error to get to the game for once, but if we get a cc in the cabinet it pales into insignificance

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:57 am  

Something that can't be disputed is that McDermott can win trophies if his players are good enough. Are his current players good enough? I have reservations. As a unit, our pack is adequate although I'm still unconvinced about the hooking role. Halves? Big question marks here IMO. Even our back five - allegedly the best in the league - seems somewhat lacking at times. For a 3/4 line heralded by many as the best in the game, it provides precious few game-breaking flashes of brilliance. Athletic prowess, yes, but the sublime incisiveness shown by the best to have played the game?

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sat Aug 02, 2014 6:11 pm  

For me Mcdermotts credentials have weakened considerably since his first two trophy winning seasons. Not because of our barren year of 2013, but because of the way we have been losing games as other teams have strengthened and we have become more vulnerable. Last nights loss in itself says a lot about the man. He obviously thinks finishing higher up the league to gain home advantage is not really much of an advantage. This despite us being dispatched with ease in 3 games we ultimately needed to win last year (Huddersfield cup, Wire and Wigan play offs) all away from home. I would certainly question his judgement on that count. Gone are the days when we rolled up at Warrington and wigan at the end of the season and win from a lowly position. We are simply not good enough to coast along and then win the play offs on our own terms, we need every bit of effort, luck, and definitely home advantage against our improving rivals. If we bomb next week, as we normally do against Warrington in the cup, Mcdermotts credibility will take another hammer blow in my book.

Re: Unsackable Mac : Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:37 am  

The Eagle wrote:

The team needs to be judged on the games which matter not the ones that don't

The Eagle wrote:

especually when I've made a special error to get to the game for once, but if we get a cc in the cabinet it pales into insignificance