Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:22 pm  

Wires71 wrote:

I think the issue is that Wigan, Saints, Leeds are undoubtably seen as the big clubs, and this can only be because of the success they have had over an extended period. We are not in that camp yet, far from it. This does not help recruitment from the NRL when we want to get the sought after players.

I don't think profile in Australia is the problem. We were able to get players like Morley, King, Hicks and Monaghan even before we'd won any Challenge Cups. We even got Andrew Johns for a few weeks. But now with the exchange rate and the higher salary cap in the NRL none of the English clubs really get major NRL players any more, unless there are some issues like Barba or Sandow.

The separating factors these days are the academy production line and making the astute signings of players that are a bit underrated but have much higher potential in the right environment. With the academy players it's not just bringing through individual superstars but bringing through a set of players that work well together and will stick together as the nucleus of a side for years. Wigan and Leeds do that far better than us. Also its signing players like Matty Smith, Blake Green, Dan Sarginson, we all scoffed at those saying they aren't exactly 'Wigan' signings, but they delivered. Luke Gale at Cas is another example, bit of a journeyman floating around lower clubs but turned out to be a star.

Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 4:22 pm  

Uncle Rico wrote:

You obviously need to embolden your cross reference to Sally's post, otherwise you never know, another poster might choose to ignore it end extend Saints' successful period to just over a decade from just under a decade to weaken your point

"I'm just a poor boy whose intentions are good, oh Lord please don't let me be misunderstood". Think I'm a lost cause!
Edits in bold!

Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 4:51 pm  

Wires71 wrote:

Since 2006 Wigan have made the GF 6 times, winning 2 times.

Winning 3 times!

Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:00 pm  

You need a core of top players that have come through the academy and then good decisions need to be made consistently on players and coaches around them. That has been a constant in leeds success, there's always been a core of academy players. Leeds is a good example to study because they went from being big underachievers to one of "the modern games most efficient winning machines". There's a nice article here : http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugb ... 6.html?amp You can put together a team with signings but without any core success will be fleeting. I don't know what it is but you need a "winning culture". Getting that first one is so important, the CC just isn't the same, you need a grand final win, 2004 was massive for leeds, it changed everything. If you can put together a good core from the academy and get that all important first gf, you'll be set.

You need a core of top players that have come through the academy and then good decisions need to be made consistently on players and coaches around them. That has been a constant in leeds success, there's always been a core of academy players. Leeds is a good example to study because they went from being big underachievers to one of "the modern games most efficient winning machines". There's a nice article here : http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugb ... 6.html?amp You can put together a team with signings but without any core success will be fleeting. I don't know what it is but you need a "winning culture". Getting that first one is so important, the CC just isn't the same, you need a grand final win, 2004 was massive for leeds, it changed everything. If you can put together a good core from the academy and get that all important first gf, you'll be set.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:17 pm  

Wires71 wrote:

Since 2006 Wigan have made the GF 6 times, winning 2 times.

Played in it 5 times since 2006 and won 3.

Re: Quiet contemplation : Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:18 pm  

Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy wrote:

Played in it 5 times since 2006 and won 3.

Apologies.