Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:16 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

What do you mean "It's not 'brainwashing' small children"?

To have got that far, they must have started by brainwashing small children. There isn't a rational human being on earth that could seriously consider those questions to be bona fide unless they had been previously brainwashed.

I became a Christian a few years ago, in my early 30s. I wasn't brainwashed.

So, if I advocated that all black or gay people were evil, would you be happy with me receiving tacit approval for an examination, aimed at furthering my prejudices, simply because I made the course suitably rigorous, that the opnly conclusions to be drawn was that I was correct?

The new Godwin's Law appears to be the invoking of blacks and racism in every single debate.

The course is set from a Christian perspective. In order to attain the qualification, students must study a wide range of Christian theology, competing doctrines and Christian history. Why can't you see the academic merit in that?

And if you consider the questions posed, to be an indication of a "suitably rigorous course", then you really are away with the fairies.

I'm no expert on what is considered suitable for Key Stage 5. That is NARIC's job.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:16 am  

cod'ead wrote: Back on topic and the batshit loons are out in force again. This time NARIC, the UK Agency responsible for providing information and opinion on examinations and courses, has found that Christian Fundamentalist ICCE is equivalent to 'A' Level Here's a selection from the history module: “True or false: Our peace – as Christians – is in Jesus Christ.” “The very next event on God’s calendar is the __________ Coming of Jesus Christ.” a. First b. Second c. Sixth “The leader of the Katanga Province was _________________.” a. Patrick Henry b. Mohammed Ali c. Moise Tshombe Remember, these are the people who reckon that the Loch Ness monster is proof that evolution theory is rubbish What's the point in studying any theology? The only benefits I can see is 'arming' people in for debates and 'spreading the word'. Are they making the A level equivalent easy so entice lazy students in?

cod'ead wrote: Back on topic and the batshit loons are out in force again. This time NARIC, the UK Agency responsible for providing information and opinion on examinations and courses, has found that Christian Fundamentalist ICCE is equivalent to 'A' Level Here's a selection from the history module: “True or false: Our peace – as Christians – is in Jesus Christ.” “The very next event on God’s calendar is the __________ Coming of Jesus Christ.” a. First b. Second c. Sixth “The leader of the Katanga Province was _________________.” a. Patrick Henry b. Mohammed Ali c. Moise Tshombe Remember, these are the people who reckon that the Loch Ness monster is proof that evolution theory is rubbish What's the point in studying any theology? The only benefits I can see is 'arming' people in for debates and 'spreading the word'. Are they making the A level equivalent easy so entice lazy students in?

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:42 am  

kirkstaller wrote:

... The course is set from a Christian perspective...

Factually incorrect.

It is set from the perspective of a particular, fundamentalist strand of Christian belief. The vast majority of Christians – and I'm talking the practising variety – in the UK and the West in general, do not believe such utter and complete idiocy.

Just as Darwin's original findings did not cause mass upset, because they could be fitted into what was known as 'old world' theology.

It's only in recent years that the import of US-style fundamentalist fuckwittery has seen such cretinism gaining traction in the UK.

I know you have difficulty with facts and logic and reasoning, but just try, for once, to get it into your skull that there are many, many different strands of Christian belief and theological interpretation – just as there with any and every other religion.

You might be such a fundamentalist reactionary extremist that you're ready to condemn anyone who doesn't agree with you as "an apostate", but that does not change reality and facts.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:55 am  

Mintball wrote:

Factually incorrect.

It is set from the perspective of a particular, fundamentalist strand of Christian belief. The vast majority of Christians – and I'm talking the practising variety – in the UK and the West in general, do not believe such utter and complete idiocy.

Just as Darwin's original findings did not cause mass upset, because they could be fitted into what was known as 'old world' theology.

It's only in recent years that the import of US-style fundamentalist fuckwittery has seen such cretinism gaining traction in the UK.

I know you have difficulty with facts and logic and reasoning, but just try, for once, to get it into your skull that there are many, many different strands of Christian belief and theological interpretation – just as there with any and every other religion.

You might be such a fundamentalist reactionary extremist that you're ready to condemn anyone who doesn't agree with you as "an apostate", but that does not change reality and facts.

Weren't they celebrated by the catholic church until they found out it had no will?

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:57 am  

McLaren_Field wrote:

Its been spotted on sonar and its been followed by a small submarine.

Apparently, according to that previous link...

Ah ... OK, fair enough, seeing as they have such solid evidence.
Can't stop now though, I've got to go and report the portrait of Mother Teresa that has just formed on my slice of toast.
It's a miracle I tell you.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:11 am  

Sheldon wrote:

Weren't they celebrated by the catholic church until they found out it had no will?

I'd have to look that up. But certainly there was no general outcry or hand-wringing etc.

Even my father, who himself was on the fundamentalist wing of the Methodist church (although he has mellowed somewhat over the years), never used to preach Creation as being literally what was laid down in Genesis: the seven days for him could have represented 7,000 or seven million, so evolution was, in many ways, no great 'problem' in the sense of species developing over time.

And that was essentially the 'old earth' way of viewing things.

As I said, it's only in relatively recent years that US-style Creationism etc has gained a foothold in the UK. And while it's not the sole reason, it's a part of what has been kicking atheists into actually 'coming out' and hitting back against such attitudes. The question of teaching this utter tripe in schools – again, a recent development – is a large part of what got Dawkins active, for instance.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:31 am  

kirkstaller wrote:

I...
It's not 'brainwashing' small children. It's essentially an A level in Christian theology. You might disagree with some other things the administrators think, but that's not really relevant, is it?

Heheh, he's back, the brainwashed man who will never answer any question.

The fact is the first two questions will be marked "wrong" (nul points) unless the candidate parrots the answer that only brainwashing can instil.

The proposition is objectively a meaningless nonsense anyway.
The question
“True or false: Our peace – as Christians – is in Jesus Christ”
could only have any academic validity whatsoever if it asked
“True or false: The religion of XYZ propounds that 'Our peace – as Christians – is in Jesus Christ'”

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:38 am  

Mintball wrote:

Even my father, who himself was on the fundamentalist wing of the Methodist church (although he has mellowed somewhat over the years), never used to preach Creation as being literally what was laid down in Genesis: the seven days for him could have represented 7,000 or seven million, so evolution was, in many ways, no great 'problem' in the sense of species developing over time.

Though it would beg the question as to why, if we're made in God's image, he waited until a maximum of 200,000 years ago to oversee the completion of our evolution, when his Earth has been around for 4.5 bn years. It also begs the question as to why he only bothered to create the Earth 4.5 bya, when he created the rest of the universe 13.5 bya.

Whilst some of the more 'enlightened' Christians may pretend that science and scripture can co-exist without a problem, they're quite obviously deluding themselves.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:44 am  

Rock God X wrote:

Though it would beg the question as to why, if we're made in God's image, he waited until a maximum of 200,000 years ago to oversee the completion of our evolution, when his Earth has been around for 4.5 bn years. It also begs the question as to why he only bothered to create the Earth 4.5 bya, when he created the rest of the universe 13.5 bya.

Whilst some of the more 'enlightened' Christians may pretend that science and scripture can co-exist without a problem, they're quite obviously deluding themselves.

Well, as he's omnipotent, I guess he can change time as well.

Anyway, how many times do you need to be told that ...
a) God moves in mysterious ways
b) You must not question God
c) He has his reasons, who are you to question him/her?

Pfft, this fundamentalism is easy innit?

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:46 am  

Rock God X wrote:

Though it would beg the question as to why, if we're made in God's image, he waited until a maximum of 200,000 years ago to oversee the completion of our evolution, when his Earth has been around for 4.5 bn years. It also begs the question as to why he only bothered to create the Earth 4.5 bya, when he created the rest of the universe 13.5 bya.

Whilst some of the more 'enlightened' Christians may pretend that science and scripture can co-exist without a problem, they're quite obviously deluding themselves.

Indeed. But frankly, they're preferable to the nutters who peddle the other version.