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The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:48 am
Posted by bellycouldtackle on Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:48 am
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Listening to Chris Chester after match he was obviously disappointed with many aspects for Fridays performance, I do not think it helped his mood that MC, who was interviewing him, pointed out that in 2015 we won our first two matches then lost the next 20 !!! Got me thinking that although we have not played to our potential there is still a great deal that the coaching staff can be pleased with and equally important there is a great deal that can be worked on and that in its own way at this time in the season is a good thing. For me there are several blatantly obvious good things :

- The form of Anthony England, he has been outstanding and our best prop, how the hell he was not MOM on Friday is beyond me
- Liam Finn found his kicking boots
- Huby looked fit ( who needs a pre season ) and played great, still think he should start with England as Fafita has his best impact off the bench.
- Hampshire looks like the real deal
- Team spirit looks good
- Team goal line defense has been impressive ( two individual school boy errors should not detract from the team effort )
- Our away support
- Still to see MCB, Arundel, Baldwinson, Anakin, Crowther, Batch and Jowitt
- We are 2 from 2, 4 points in the bag, a fifth of the way to probable top 8 points requirement

In the OK section :

- Miller, produced spells of brilliance, he read of Hampshire`s kick was superb. Would just like to see him take the line on more, he seemed to just go through the motions on Friday until the last 15 mins, then it was like ... right I need to do something ... and he stepped up and was brilliant
- Paulie Paulie looks like he is enjoying life and should be getting fitter - broken leg, car crash very little Rugby is a hell of a lot to come back from, so massive credit to to the lad

In the needs work column :

- Not sure of the numbers but we are giving away a silly amount of penalties
- Kirmond not had the best of starts : again we know he is a good player so he will improve, perhaps he is trying to hard as he knows there is massive competition for back row places
- Game management has been poor so far and is the biggest concern, the on field decision making has been shocking : not taking the two points when on offer is still hurting us, this happened last season and shows no sign of improving. 6 nil up on Friday and not taking the two against an obviously determined well drilled Salford side was criminal
- We do not seem to have a drop goal set of six in the locker. 40 seconds to go before half time and 4 mins to go before the end it was crying out for a drop goal, we looked clueless , there was a real lack of leadership and direction at these crucial stages. Where are the brains in the team ?
- Home support : just over 4000 to watch the best team we have had in years is a disgrace. Thank goodness for the vibrant, busy, fabulous corporate entertainment, because we cannot rely on walked up so called supporters.
- Some tough decisions to be made on the fourth prop that CC has to make, if all fit I think that England and Huby are shoe ins for starting, Fafita has to play so takes up a bench spot, he is a real game changer when he comes on off the bench. Not sure that PP and Fafita on the pitch at the same time works well ( I know we are only two games in ) especially in defense, I thought Tomkins exploited the two big men around the ruck and made great yards for then. Perhaps we should give way on size and go for a bit more defensive mobility with the fourth prop, maybe its time to give Baldwinson a few games to show us what he can do.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:32 pm
Posted by Fordy on Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:32 pm
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I agree about England - he was outstanding on Friday.
I think you might be right about not having Dave and Pauli on together but I'd be playing England and Fifita and then replacing with Huby and PP.
Kirmo does seem to have been the least effective (so far) of the second row options and might be the one to make way for one of the guys waiting in the wings. Hirst back in and PP playing further out wide in the 2nd row could be an option??
As for the drop goal situation - I think there was only the players out there who weren't looking for it - every fan I've spoken to was crying out for it, especially the one with 5 mins to go.. Game management definitely needs some work.

All in all though, it's hard to be critical of the team when they've played 2 and won 2.


Major disappointment for me has been Annakin, I haven't seen anything from him at all as yet. :wink: :wink:
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Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:39 pm
Posted by vastman on Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:39 pm
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bellycouldtackle wrote:
Listening to Chris Chester after match he was obviously disappointed with many aspects for Fridays performance, I do not think it helped his mood that MC, who was interviewing him, pointed out that in 2015 we won our first two matches then lost the next 20 !!! Got me thinking that although we have not played to our potential there is still a great deal that the coaching staff can be pleased with and equally important there is a great deal that can be worked on and that in its own way at this time in the season is a good thing. For me there are several blatantly obvious good things :

- The form of Anthony England, he has been outstanding and our best prop, how the hell he was not MOM on Friday is beyond me
- Liam Finn found his kicking boots
- Huby looked fit ( who needs a pre season ) and played great, still think he should start with England as Fafita has his best impact off the bench.
- Hampshire looks like the real deal
- Team spirit looks good
- Team goal line defense has been impressive ( two individual school boy errors should not detract from the team effort )
- Our away support
- Still to see MCB, Arundel, Baldwinson, Anakin, Crowther, Batch and Jowitt
- We are 2 from 2, 4 points in the bag, a fifth of the way to probable top 8 points requirement

In the OK section :

- Miller, produced spells of brilliance, he read of Hampshire`s kick was superb. Would just like to see him take the line on more, he seemed to just go through the motions on Friday until the last 15 mins, then it was like ... right I need to do something ... and he stepped up and was brilliant
- Paulie Paulie looks like he is enjoying life and should be getting fitter - broken leg, car crash very little Rugby is a hell of a lot to come back from, so massive credit to to the lad

In the needs work column :

- Not sure of the numbers but we are giving away a silly amount of penalties
- Kirmond not had the best of starts : again we know he is a good player so he will improve, perhaps he is trying to hard as he knows there is massive competition for back row places
- Game management has been poor so far and is the biggest concern, the on field decision making has been shocking : not taking the two points when on offer is still hurting us, this happened last season and shows no sign of improving. 6 nil up on Friday and not taking the two against an obviously determined well drilled Salford side was criminal
- We do not seem to have a drop goal set of six in the locker. 40 seconds to go before half time and 4 mins to go before the end it was crying out for a drop goal, we looked clueless , there was a real lack of leadership and direction at these crucial stages. Where are the brains in the team ?
- Home support : just over 4000 to watch the best team we have had in years is a disgrace. Thank goodness for the vibrant, busy, fabulous corporate entertainment, because we cannot rely on walked up so called supporters.
- Some tough decisions to be made on the fourth prop that CC has to make, if all fit I think that England and Huby are shoe ins for starting, Fafita has to play so takes up a bench spot, he is a real game changer when he comes on off the bench. Not sure that PP and Fafita on the pitch at the same time works well ( I know we are only two games in ) especially in defense, I thought Tomkins exploited the two big men around the ruck and made great yards for then. Perhaps we should give way on size and go for a bit more defensive mobility with the fourth prop, maybe its time to give Baldwinson a few games to show us what he can do.


Two points - totally agree about England, was a stand out in last years 8's and has carried it on. On present form he's good enough to not just be called England but play for them.

Secondly, far to early to be messing with the line up - only thing I would do is play Hampshire for more minutes. Brought him on to lated on Friday IMHO.
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Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:21 pm
Posted by imwakefieldtillidie on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:21 pm
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I think Fifita's concussion check messed with the rotation a little and that's why him and Pauli were on together.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:31 pm
Posted by Wildcat26 on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:31 pm
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Good post, just about sums it up for me. Prop is a tricky one for Chester as i thought Hirst went very well at KR as well, although he did show he still has the odd simple error in him which needs ironing out. If Chester can successfully implement Pauli into the second row as he wants to then that is a scary thought of a big forward pack. No doubt our strength in depth will come in useful as the season goes on.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:39 pm
Posted by Shifty Cat on Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:39 pm
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Can't argue with most of that Belly.
Personally, I wouldn't mess with the starting Props, both England and Fifita look as fit as they ever have and are both doing big minutes when called on and have hardly missed a tackle between them, while both making good meters.
Just looking at their stats so far, they are virtually the same, Fifita meters 240, AG 7.50, Tackles 60. England meters 246, AG 7.24, tackles 57. Also just noticed Miller's assisted in 5 or our 8 tries.

As someone said above Dave's concussion test messed with the prop rotation, so we ended up with Dave and Pauli on at the same time, which at the moment probably isn't the way I'd go. I'd have Pauli on the bench with Huby. If Pauli is out with a broken nose we bring Hirst back in. Someone mentioned above that he thought Hirst had a good game in Hull, personally I thought he was the only prop that Hull KR managed to deal with , which was surprising because he'd really improved in the yards especially after contact as the season went on last season. saying that it was the first game of the season so can't really criticise the lad off that, just an observation. Like you say there's also Baldwisnon sitting waiting for a chance as well.

Also, agree with Vasty's point on maybe seeing Hampshire do more minutes because he does look lively when he comes on and I think he'll just improve.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:04 pm
Posted by The Avenger on Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:04 pm
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I’ll add, we don’t look the same team when Arona goes off and we instantly look more solid when he returns. His work rate and effectiveness in both attack and defence coupled with him being like a very mobile prop is hugely valuable to our functionality as a team.

He’s very often the unsung hero in our better performances and nearly always the best we’ve got when we don’t play well. Possibly the best value overseas player in the league.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:08 pm
Posted by vastman on Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:08 pm
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The Avenger wrote:
I’ll add, we don’t look the same team when Arona goes off and we instantly look more solid when he returns. His work rate and effectiveness in both attack and defence coupled with him being like a very mobile prop is hugely valuable to our functionality as a team.

He’s very often the unsung hero in our better performances and nearly always the best we’ve got when we don’t play well. Possibly the best value overseas player in the league.


Arona plays 13 doesn't he? Though I admit it's hard to tell who plays where these days :?
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Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:15 pm
Posted by The Avenger on Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:15 pm
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vastman wrote:
Arona plays 13 doesn't he? Though I admit it's hard to tell who plays where these days :?


He does play 13, which is often where teams play their 3rd prop on the field. Arona fits the bill almost perfectly as he has size, a high work rate and good legspeed, he lacks or doesn’t often show slick handling ability otherwise he’s ideal for the role.
Re: The good, ok and needs work
Post Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:59 pm
Posted by BOJ042 on Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:59 pm
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can I ask who was the last player to represent England/GB whislt playing at wakey....

surely with this team we should at least get 1 in a squad even if they don't get game time.

its got to be ASHURST FOR ME
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