Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 11:07 am  

The Avenger wrote:

I prefer

'The Brinbreds'

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 12:17 pm  

The Avenger wrote: The economic argument certainly isn't lost. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstop ... ealth.html An interesting read, but here's some bullet points: The Commonwealth (remember them) Trading block is the fastest growing of its type in the world yet we are held back from forging trade links with them by being members of the EU. The EU is the world's only declining trade block. Reports from the The Office of National Statistics show we now export more to countries outside of Europe than to countries inside Europe According to World Economics, in 2013 the Commonwealth economy overtook the Eurozone's. The IMF forecasts that by 2019 the Commonwealth will have overtaken the EU contributing 17.7 per cent to the world’s output compared with the EU’s 15.3 per cent. The Commonwealth also has far more favourable demographic figures. Continental Europe is in long term economic decline. Presently, the EU28 countries amount to only 19 percent of world Gross Domestic Product (GDP) -- the most common measurement of economic strength. Meanwhile the Commonwealth is only slightly behind on 16 percent, the difference being that the Commonwealth is the fastest growing. By 2025 the Commonwealth will have surpassed the EU, more importantly, the Commonwealth has a population of over 2 billion people, 4 times the population of the EU! The Economic argument is far far from lost! Then there's the 'five eyes' countries that make up the Anglosphere Ah the old flawed commonwealth argument. Farage claims we could trade with them instead and not need a trade agreement with Europe. It's a complete fallacy, even the official leave campaign (of which he isn't part) doesn't agree with him. Lets take 3 of the bigger countries, ones that also happen to be part of the Anglosphere, Australia, New Zealand and Canada. Put them all together and their combined population is lower than that of the UK and their collective GDP is just 15% higher than the UK. There just isn't the room for growth there that will fill the gap of the loss of trade from the EU. As for trading with the likes of growing economies like India the EU and other countries have been arranging trade deals with them for 7 years and counting, just like they have with Canada. We would be starting from scratch and would way down the list of priorities, just like we would for any if the trade agreements needed with other countires.

The Avenger wrote: The economic argument certainly isn't lost. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstop ... ealth.html An interesting read, but here's some bullet points: The Commonwealth (remember them) Trading block is the fastest growing of its type in the world yet we are held back from forging trade links with them by being members of the EU. The EU is the world's only declining trade block. Reports from the The Office of National Statistics show we now export more to countries outside of Europe than to countries inside Europe According to World Economics, in 2013 the Commonwealth economy overtook the Eurozone's. The IMF forecasts that by 2019 the Commonwealth will have overtaken the EU contributing 17.7 per cent to the world’s output compared with the EU’s 15.3 per cent. The Commonwealth also has far more favourable demographic figures. Continental Europe is in long term economic decline. Presently, the EU28 countries amount to only 19 percent of world Gross Domestic Product (GDP) -- the most common measurement of economic strength. Meanwhile the Commonwealth is only slightly behind on 16 percent, the difference being that the Commonwealth is the fastest growing. By 2025 the Commonwealth will have surpassed the EU, more importantly, the Commonwealth has a population of over 2 billion people, 4 times the population of the EU! The Economic argument is far far from lost! Then there's the 'five eyes' countries that make up the Anglosphere Ah the old flawed commonwealth argument. Farage claims we could trade with them instead and not need a trade agreement with Europe. It's a complete fallacy, even the official leave campaign (of which he isn't part) doesn't agree with him. Lets take 3 of the bigger countries, ones that also happen to be part of the Anglosphere, Australia, New Zealand and Canada. Put them all together and their combined population is lower than that of the UK and their collective GDP is just 15% higher than the UK. There just isn't the room for growth there that will fill the gap of the loss of trade from the EU. As for trading with the likes of growing economies like India the EU and other countries have been arranging trade deals with them for 7 years and counting, just like they have with Canada. We would be starting from scratch and would way down the list of priorities, just like we would for any if the trade agreements needed with other countires.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 12:39 pm  

Like the way you ignored all the facts in my post, also that you ignored India and, well, the rest of the world as places we could trade with if only we weren't prevented from doing so by the EU.

I'll have a look at democracy and governance next!

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 1:43 pm  

The Avenger wrote:

Like the way you ignored all the facts in my post, also that you ignored India and, well, the rest of the world as places we could trade with if only we weren't prevented from doing so by the EU.

I'll have a look at democracy and governance next!

Certain irony you accusing someone of ignoring facts! Firstly we already trade with the commonwealth countries through the existing EU trade agreement, so we start again there. In the meantime we are on the outer. You'll see i mentioned india and the time it would take to arrange a trade deal, or did you just ignore that as well. And remember with younger growing economies they often peak early, over expand and fall back quickly, it carries much more economic risk that dealing with established economies. China are a prime example if this, as are places like indonesia. As for all the other countries we are apparently prevented from trading with, the only ones we are are the countries with such lovely attributes of high levels of corruption and human rights abuse. If we are happy to deal with contries who deal in child labour, worker abuse and mass embezzlement and have no itention of changing then yes i suppose we could. Personally i would like to think that as a country we have higher moral standards than that. Still maybe part of the trade agreements would be a freedom of movement between those countries so they could improve their lives over here?

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 3:45 pm  

Britain saw a near 34% rise in exports to India, 31.2% to South Africa, 30% to Australia, 18.3% to Canada in the last 2 years alone.
The Commonwealth contains at least seven of the fastest-growing global Countries/economies.

In an ideal world we'd be able to trade with both and as you say we possibly could if we remain in the EU and the EU strikes a trade agreement with the Commonwealth. Unfortunately as with most things EU it won't be an agreement that suits the UK but rather it will suit France & Germany etc. and we'll have to accept the terms whatever they may be.

Beyond that the TTIP agreement will further marginalise our interests.

We have the 5th largest economy in the world and there are enough trade partners out there for us to negotiate our own deals. We don't need to be part of the EU which isn't the utopia the ins are portraying it to be, it's failing and shrinking.

Furthermore, I'm unsure whether Westminster knows how to govern Yorkshire, they certainly don't represent me or my interests, so I'm bloody well sure that being governed more and more by Brussels isn't what I want or need. I certainly don't want to see our sovereignty pick pocketed away by self serving Eurocrats and corrupt politicians who are making decisions based on hew best to feather their own post political career nests.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 9:43 pm  

The last time I looked at this thread was on my mobile which doesn't have the ad blocker installed. Ironically there was a sponsored advert for the EU referendum from Richard Branson asking us to vote IN. Thanks for that multi-billionaire Richard, you're really on my level and I feel totally connected with you while you send emails from your own private island.

If us minions are going to be told how to vote, please don't take the loving mickey out of us!

Both sides are guilty of not telling the truth but I get the feeling the IN crowd have way more to lose than anyone else and they couldn't give a poop about the rest of us so long as they get the result that's best for them.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Sun May 29, 2016 10:28 pm  

The Avenger wrote:

Like the way you ignored all the facts in my post, also that you ignored India and, well, the rest of the world as places we could trade with if only we weren't prevented from doing so by the EU.

I'll have a look at democracy and governance next!

I like the way you ignore that i was able to find, quite easily, something you thought I wouldn't.
One thing is clear though and that's that you're not interested in debate; only winning an argument. You've made your mind up and seem to struggle to cope with anyone who doesn't see it exactly how you do.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Mon May 30, 2016 7:02 am  

I think most people have by now made up their mind which way to vote. Since day 1 no amount of scaremongering by the fat cats of big business and banking has made me any less certain that for the longer term good of both the UK and more importantly my offspring then it has to be leave.
I'm sure those who want the country to continue in it's down wood spiral away from being an independent nation (for whatever reason?) won't be swayed either.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Mon May 30, 2016 7:23 am  

The EU has its own plan for its future. An ever closer union to create an effective one nation of europe, and a single currency in the euro. All the main players are signed up to the plan.

We are not taken seriously by the EU because we are not signed up to the plan, despite the huge amount of money coming from this country.

In reality this is not an In or Out referendum, more of an Out or continue to hang off the side of the EU.

The options really should be

IN and sign up fully to the plan and actually get some power within the EU

OUT and go it alone.

But not

REMAIN ie. Limp along in the no mans land as we do now.

Re: Totally off topic but........ : Mon May 30, 2016 8:33 am  

captaincaveman wrote:

The EU has its own plan for its future. An ever closer union to create an effective one nation of europe, and a single currency in the euro. All the main players are signed up to the plan.

We are not taken seriously by the EU because we are not signed up to the plan, despite the huge amount of money coming from this country.

In reality this is not an In or Out referendum, more of an Out or continue to hang off the side of the EU.

The options really should be

IN and sign up fully to the plan and actually get some power within the EU

OUT and go it alone.

But not

REMAIN ie. Limp along in the no mans land as we do now.

For a German your English is very good.