Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:02 pm  

chissitt wrote:

Not being as knowledgeable as a couple on here would have you believe they are, for me it's pretty simple every young player has a price, and when you are strapped for cash as we are and cannot afford to keep them interested financially like the big clubs' and can't offer them regular first team football because they are simply not good enough yet, just what are the club supposed to do when clubs' come along like Bradford and Leigh what can offer regular games and more money because they don't have to pay for expensive foreign imports, I'm sure that the club realise their potential just as much as the other clubs that bought them do, and in an ideal world they would still be here but mainly because of finances there not, Kay had one good game for us made famous by big Ali against Cas, Washaw although he may do in the future has not exactly ripped it up at Bradford yet, all the club is guilty of is letting potential go and not world beaters, but it suits some people on here's agenda to cause mischief by having you believe so.

I think Avenger ,I hope,cares about and feels passionate about the youth at Wakey as much as I do especially as Jordy is one of them.We as the Crowther family have been fortunate to have seen his progress through scholarship into his debut last season and 3 appearances on the bounce this season maybe due to injuries,but hopefully on merit so we may have been blinkered a little bit by just focusing on his pathway,maybe,I don't know,but I hope that others like Tom and Max plus others on the programme get their chances to wear the shirt.....hopefully.

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:22 pm  

Big lads mate wrote:

I think Avenger ,I hope,cares about and feels passionate about the youth at Wakey as much as I do especially as Jordy is one of them.We as the Crowther family have been fortunate to have seen his progress through scholarship into his debut last season and 3 appearances on the bounce this season maybe due to injuries,but hopefully on merit so we may have been blinkered a little bit by just focusing on his pathway,maybe,I don't know,but I hope that others like Tom and Max plus others on the programme get their chances to wear the shirt.....hopefully.

I do and I'm not being critical just for the sake of it, I want us to be better!

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:54 pm  

The Avenger wrote:

Who are you referring to Chisitt? (chissitt) Edit

I'm certainly not mischief making, just pointing out what I believe is the case at Wakefield, maybe I'm wrong!

If I'm right and if you're right (our views aren't necessarily mutually exclusive) and we accept your view for the truth then, as fans, we can't moan about letting our young players go.

Our opinions' for what their worth do differ here, I don't know what goes on at the club, but I'm more inclined to think that it's more to do with finances than the theories that their not good enough, and it's not a case of letting them go, more so one of not being able to keep them which is a different thing altogether.

The Avenger wrote:

If that's the case though, we have to accept and get comfortable with the reality that we will never attract or hold onto the better juniors. We will always have to bring cast offs, overseas 'B' class players and near retirees to Wakefield while waving our established young superstars goodbye as they move on to Leeds.

It's exactly that, has been for a fair while now, I've accepted it, it's less frustrating
As for Leeds, they've been pinching our players' since Roy Francis was their coach in the sixties, remember George Shepherd, David Jeanes, Bob Haigh, just to name a few.

The Avenger wrote:

While our nearly established young players with potential to make it are never trusted enough to get the job done while they learn their trade, as juniors at other clubs are allowed to do, so they'll move on to Leigh and Bradford.

Who other than you are saying they can't be trusted, Webster certainly hasn't unless you've heard different, as much as they want to, everybody cannot pick the team every week, and whether you like it or not he's the man atm, these lads are 18 years old and just maybe the coach is acting responsibly by managing their game time, I don't know and I suspect neither do you, but I don't think it helps continually coming out with the same theory all the time.

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:11 pm  

Like you say Chissett,they are managing Jordy due to age and maturity but coming back to players being shipped out from the Wakey ranks,even the so called big clubs are guilty of not trusting their youth.Look at Fox,came to Trin,played well,money talked,next step HKR then England.Kyle Amore same,we have been a proven breeding ground for players who slipped under the radar elsewhere and been put in the spotlight for the parasites to take away,Warrington only use the cheque book.Until we can compete financially with them we have to accept it.

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:24 pm  

Big lads mate wrote:

I think Avenger ,I hope,cares about and feels passionate about the youth at Wakey as much as I do especially as Jordy is one of them.We as the Crowther family have been fortunate to have seen his progress through scholarship into his debut last season and 3 appearances on the bounce this season maybe due to injuries,but hopefully on merit so we may have been blinkered a little bit by just focusing on his pathway,maybe,I don't know,but I hope that others like Tom and Max plus others on the programme get their chances to wear the shirt.....hopefully.

Martin, I've sat on the fun bus with the Crowther family watching young Jordy running up and down the aisle growing up, the only ground I've not seen you and your family is Perpignan, I know how proud you are as a family just being Wakey supporters' never mind having your young un wearing the shirt. At the Catalan game I said to you I'm glad Jordan wasn't selected, not because I did not want him to play more a question of game management against those massive forwards, it's the same with young Max imo we are not playing good enough to lob him in at FB, Craig Hall a quality player is struggling there atm, what might that do to the young lads confidence, but I agree with Johnstone, the way Riley is playing atm he should get a shot, I'm sure they will get their chance maybe sooner than later and hopefully they will take it.

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:52 pm  

chissitt wrote:

Our opinions' for what their worth do differ here, I don't know what goes on at the club, but I'm more inclined to think that it's more to do with finances than the theories that their not good enough, and it's not a case of letting them go, more so one of not being able to keep them which is a different thing altogether.

It's exactly that, has been for a fair while now, I've accepted it, it's less frustrating
As for Leeds, they've been pinching our players' since Roy Francis was their coach in the sixties, remember George Shepherd, David Jeanes, Bob Haigh, just to name a few.

Who other than you are saying they can't be trusted, Webster certainly hasn't unless you've heard different, as much as they want to, everybody cannot pick the team every week, and whether you like it or not he's the man atm, these lads are 18 years old and just maybe the coach is acting responsibly by managing their game time, I don't know and I suspect neither do you, but I don't think it helps continually coming out with the same theory all the time.

Of course it's money but . . .

. . . I don't think it's just money, if the incumbent Coach actually trusted a youth development process and had genuine faith in his own ability to further and finish a players development while integrating said player into his SL team then he'd also attach the correct monetary value to said player. He'd pay HIM what he's worth instead of letting him go only to pay more to AN Other player who is more developed and does a job here and now yet has less potential in the long term.

Maybe Webster is doing this with Jordy, Max and Tom, I don't know, I'm happy to give him the benefit of the doubt. He's certainly not to blame for Kay, Walshaw, Wildie, Cowling or Potts that lays at the feet of Kear and Agar.

I'm not just talking about now but the last 25 years or so but particularly the Agar & Kear regimes, that's who hasn't trusted the players, them and quite a few others, it's not just me saying it it's happened for decades.

Maybe it's our Lott as a club to be condemned to do this forever more. Maybe we'll never be wealthy enough to break the cycle

I'm sorry if I'm trotting out the same theories as have been regurgitated time and time before but I haven't read this discussion before!

Re: Tom Johnstone : Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:28 pm  

chissitt wrote:

Martin, I've sat on the fun bus with the Crowther family watching young Jordy running up and down the aisle growing up, the only ground I've not seen you and your family is Perpignan, I know how proud you are as a family just being Wakey supporters' never mind having your young un wearing the shirt. At the Catalan game I said to you I'm glad Jordan wasn't selected, not because I did not want him to play more a question of game management against those massive forwards, it's the same with young Max imo we are not playing good enough to lob him in at FB, Craig Hall a quality player is struggling there atm, what might that do to the young lads confidence, but I agree with Johnstone, the way Riley is playing atm he should get a shot, I'm sure they will get their chance maybe sooner than later and hopefully they will take it.

I don't slag players off on here and never will as I know how hard the game is,but,and a big but,I agree that Tom needs a shot and when he does hopefully takes it with both hands,regarding Catalans,Jordy his mum and myself went when they actually won under the Kear regime .Seems a million miles away