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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:49 am  
Sarge needs to watch endless clips of George Carmont and see what a truly great winger does and doesn't do.

I guarantee I will be tapping at this keyboard in 2 months time frustrated at the lack of passes our winger gets - mark my words!
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:11 am  
Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy wrote:
Only time will tell if the issues have been addressed or not. Your confidence seems to be based on hope rather than evidence. We'll need to wait until the season progresses before we actually have an answer.



This is so pessimistic. Wigan have addressed the issues with rearranging positioning, bringing in a kicking coach etc, this is evidence based, from this I have hope. What more do you want at this stage? For one I'm pleased we've addressed issues. Like I said, big season for Wane. If he doesn't perform as a head coach it's possible it could be his last.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:17 am  
Tricky Dicky wrote:
I wish we did have halves that played like it was 1985. I long for the days to return where we had halves that can play with each other rather than just left or just right.


Debatable. When a team is totally lead around the field by an 'off the cuff' creative half, the team becomes dependent on their creativity to make things happen, when they're injured and replace the whole team looks completely different as they've been dependent on that one player, the old school 7.

Now with structures, a team and the halves play to to the structure meaning there's less impact on losing a star half.

A good argument case study would be Castleford with Rangi v Cas without Rangi. They were often dependent on flashes of his individual skill and flair to breakdown the defence. Now they play much more structured and are a far better team.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:43 am  
Last Son of Wigan wrote:
This is so pessimistic. Wigan have addressed the issues with rearranging positioning, bringing in a kicking coach etc, this is evidence based, from this I have hope. What more do you want at this stage? For one I'm pleased we've addressed issues. Like I said, big season for Wane. If he doesn't perform as a head coach it's possible it could be his last.


It's not pessimistic, it's waiting for evidence that things are actually going to change on the field. Given the season hasn't even started yet we don't know if the changes being made will actually address the issues - if not done correctly they could make things worse.

Like I said (on more than one occasion) no one knows how things will pan out. I hope we sort things out and win every game and every trophy on offer but I'm not going to be a happy clapper or doom monger at this stage.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:10 am  
Tricky Dicky wrote:
I wish we did have halves that played like it was 1985. I long for the days to return where we had halves that can play with each other rather than just left or just right.


The split half’s thing is an interesting one and not as clear cut as many seem to think. It only really applies when the PTM is somewhere near the middle of the pitch, in that situation having a half back on each side gives the team an option of which way to go and means the defence is unsure of which way the ball goes. If the PTB is on either edge then the half’s line up together just as they did in 1985. In reality it’s not too much different to how it’s always been.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:38 pm  
Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy wrote:
It's not pessimistic, it's waiting for evidence that things are actually going to change on the field. Given the season hasn't even started yet we don't know if the changes being made will actually address the issues - if not done correctly they could make things worse.

Like I said (on more than one occasion) no one knows how things will pan out. I hope we sort things out and win every game and every trophy on offer but I'm not going to be a happy clapper or doom monger at this stage.


Are you not happy Wigan have been proactive to address the problems? What more can they possibly do at this stage?
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:43 pm  
Trainman wrote:
The split half’s thing is an interesting one and not as clear cut as many seem to think. It only really applies when the PTM is somewhere near the middle of the pitch, in that situation having a half back on each side gives the team an option of which way to go and means the defence is unsure of which way the ball goes. If the PTB is on either edge then the half’s line up together just as they did in 1985. In reality it’s not too much different to how it’s always been.


More to the point the FB is now the second receiver who links up outside (on either left or right side) outside of the half back.

I think the positional names throw people off. Really they should be called something like:

FB= Deep lying second receiver
Winger= still pretty apt
centres=outside edges (only in union do they play in the centre)
Prop/13=Middles (props hardly prop up the scrum anymore)
Hooker=dummy half (do they ever hook for the ball?)
SR=Edges (a scrum is made up of whoever, they don't specifically need to be in the SR of a scrum)
scrum half/stand off=left and right halfback

something like that.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 2:18 pm  
Last Son of Wigan wrote:
Are you not happy Wigan have been proactive to address the problems? What more can they possibly do at this stage?


Ah I see we're getting to the straw man part of the discussion. Where have I said I wasn't happy? I've simply identified a number of issues, I and a number of other fans saw as problems on the field last season and things that happened during the off season. Let's see if Wane has sorted them out.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:53 pm  
Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy wrote:
Ah I see we're getting to the straw man part of the discussion. Where have I said I wasn't happy? I've simply identified a number of issues, I and a number of other fans saw as problems on the field last season and things that happened during the off season. Let's see if Wane has sorted them out.


You're clearly unhappy to list several issues you have.

And as I replied, all your issues have been addressed in pre-season. I don't see what else you'd want or expect at this stage. I'm happy issues have been addressed. At this stage all Wigan and Wane can do is be proactive, to identity then address the issues which they have.
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Re: Wane hopeful for new season : Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:51 pm  
Last Son of Wigan wrote:
You're clearly unhappy to list several issues you have.

And as I replied, all your issues have been addressed in pre-season. I don't see what else you'd want or expect at this stage. I'm happy issues have been addressed. At this stage all Wigan and Wane can do is be proactive, to identity then address the issues which they have.


You're happy issues have been addressed without knowing if the issues have actually been addressed.

I'll wait to see a number of games (probably 10 or so) before deciding.
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