Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:15 pm  

Let's be right: the rich, the powerful, the well paid, be they politicians, pop stars, sports stars, they give homilies to us simple folk; don't drink, don't smoke, don't take drugs, don't do promiscuous sex, etc, etc etc.

Meanwhile, behind closed doors, do they practise what they preach? Do they hell! And it was ever thus, from Henry VIII''s time (and earlier) to the present day.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:16 pm  

moto748 wrote:

Imagine senior politicians taking drugs, consorting with prostitutes... the very idea is unthinkable!

Just ask George Osborne!

And if you think the police are beacons of rectitude, well...

I know for a fact there are bad apples in the police. I also know for a fact that if they are ever proven as a bad apple they are dealt with far more harshly than anybody in any other walk of life!
Once you put yourself up there, the onus is on you to maintain the standards expected and if you can't then I believe it's right you are dealt with appropriately.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:05 am  

Aboveusonlypie wrote:

I don't agree that there should be no distinction between cheats and those who merely use recreational drugs. Cheats should be banned for life. But I struggle to see what harm Hardaker was doing other than to himself. To me a six month ban for a first offence with maybe two years for a second offence seems a lot fairer.

The interesting thing about cocaine is that WADA class it as performance enhancing if found in the system on game day. As he tested positive after a match as far as WADA are concerned he was cheating.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:20 pm  

Trainman wrote:

The interesting thing about cocaine is that WADA class it as performance enhancing if found in the system on game day. As he tested positive after a match as far as WADA are concerned he was cheating.

cocaine is a stimulant so it is cheating

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:25 pm  

Pieman wrote:

cocaine is a stimulant so it is cheating

I agree. They don't call it Colombian marching powder for nothing.

You want to see how the idiots drive round here when full of 'cocaine'. They think they are bloody invincible. We have had several fatalities in the last two years when they have lost control of their vehicles driving at high speed.

[DaveO]

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:22 pm  

Itchy Arsenal wrote:

I am pretty sure that most people if convicted of taking class A drugs would be dismissed from their job.
The only reason I suspect that sportsmen don't get dismissed is because they are a saleable asset to their club.
Personally if I owned Wigan RLFC I would have weekly checks for substance abuse and anyone with a positive result would be immediately suspended subject to secondary check ( which I think is standard practice) and if that proves also to be positive then I would terminate their employment immediately.

Owners need to take the moral ground. Players need to be aware of their responsibilities and the consequences if they break the law.

I personally I wouldn't ban a player for life fir a first offence because we are all human and we all make mistakes however, I would go along with a 2 year ban and a second offence irrespective of time since first offence would then mean a lifetime ban.

I agree though when did it become an offence to take class A drugs? Don't you have to be caught in possession? I honestly don't know but it's unlikely you are going to be tested regularly for substance abuse if you are in an ordinary job. Hardaker, Hock and the rest of the RL players know they aren't in an ordinary job and regardless of whether cocaine is performance enhancing or not, they know the penalty they face if caught using it. They also know they are going to be tested. All seems pretty straightforward to me. Do drugs as an RL player, get banned. They are lucky there is way back after two years.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:24 pm  

DaveO wrote:

I agree though when did it become an offence to take class A drugs? Don't you have to be caught in possession? I honestly don't know but it's unlikely you are going to be tested regularly for substance abuse if you are in an ordinary job. Hardaker, Hock and the rest of the RL players know they aren't in an ordinary job and regardless of whether cocaine is performance enhancing or not, they know the penalty they face if caught using it. They also know they are going to be tested. All seems pretty straightforward to me. Do drugs as an RL player, get banned. They are lucky there is way back after two years.

becoming very common

[DaveO]

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:10 pm  

Pieman wrote:

becoming very common

What in an ordinary job like mine, in computer software and in the UK? Never heard of it in commercial software. Now granted there are rules my employer has that are more restrictive than when I first started in the 1980's and if I was in the USA ( I work for an American company) even stricter still, but actual testing? They would get told where to go.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:55 pm  

Testing is quite common for drivers in some industries. You don't want someone off their head driving an HGV, coach or train. I have heard of chemical and pharmaceutical companies testing people as well. I guess some medical professionals are also tested. You want to make sure that people with access to drugs don't start abusing them.

Re: Hardaker kicked out of grand final squad... : Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:09 am  

We used to get tested in office jobs of an energy company, in part because it enabled the company to tell guys in the field (where it could lead to serious injury or death) that they weren't being picked on. Even in an office job, everyone knew it was a sackable offence for a positive test. I know this sort of testing has expanded well beyond oil and gas now.

The rules in the job Hardaker gets paid for clearly state the penalties if he takes drugs and gets caught. I don't care what happens in wider 'society' - he knew the rules and decided to risk everything anyway. No sympathy at all with respect to the penalty. Supporting him through this is a different matter, but that's up to Cas and the RFL.