Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:45 pm  

I worry the coaching staff trying to find the right positions for players are harming the development of certain young talent.

For example Jack Hughes, a SR forward who breaks into the team as a SR, then he's told he's going to play centre, even given the number 4 shirt. Then when HH is injured he's moved back into SR, Thornley replaces Jack in the centres, HH comes back and Jack is pushed out of the team not knowing if he's a SR or centre.

Then Sam Powell, a 6/7 comes through as a 6/7, plays an excellent game v NZW rolls his ankle and is brought back primarily as a cover 9 for McM, now is a half or a 9, this chopping and changing might be ok for senior players who know the game but for development a player needs time not only to adjust to SL but to that position, I worry his development might cost him.

Hampshire is now the same 1 or a 6?
Just wait, groomed as a 1. Bowen leaves, Sam returns early and Rocky is out.

Additionally I can't help but think Williams has the 6 shirt by default as both Hampshire and Powell missed a lot of game time last year due to injury not ability; if they would have remained fit it maybe we'd be starting with a different 6.

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:02 pm  

Last Son of Wigan wrote:

I worry the coaching staff trying to find the right positions for players are harming the development of certain young talent.

For example Jack Hughes, a SR forward who breaks into the team as a SR, then he's told he's going to play centre, even given the number 4 shirt. Then when HH is injured he's moved back into SR, Thornley replaces Jack in the centres, HH comes back and Jack is pushed out of the team not knowing if he's a SR or centre.

Then Sam Powell, a 6/7 comes through as a 6/7, plays an excellent game v NZW rolls his ankle and is brought back primarily as a cover 9 for McM, now is a half or a 9, this chopping and changing might be ok for senior players who know the game but for development a player needs time not only to adjust to SL but to that position, I worry his development might cost him.

Hampshire is now the same 1 or a 6?
Just wait, groomed as a 1. Bowen leaves, Sam returns early and Rocky is out.

Additionally I can't help but think Williams has the 6 shirt by default as both Hampshire and Powell missed a lot of game time last year due to injury not ability; if they would have remained fit it maybe we'd be starting with a different 6.

Spot on, it's almost the 'in thing' putting players into positions that they've never played. It started with Sam who, whilst being an undoubted success, i would still prefer to see @ 6. World Class 1's come around quite often but world class 6's are once in a generation. I still don't for a second doubt that Sam could have been the greatest GB stand off of the last 20 + years.

FWIW, and i've held this opinion for a while, i don't think any of our options at 6 are good enough for next season. I think it takes more than a season to really establish yourself in the first team and get to a point where you can impose yourself on the side. None of our 6's are currently in that position.

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:33 pm  

Noticed that in Shaun's post Leigh match brief he mentioned "Rocky went well in the halves".
He did and was very dangerous too. SW didn't of course mention how he went at FB. For those who've insisted on here that Hampshire is a 6 then the Leigh game went a long way to confirm that.
As there aren't many (any) English SL halves with real pace Ryan H could make a name for himself at stand off if given the game time.
He must be the fastest half back in SL and that has to help a great deal.

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 9:29 pm  

Whilst I do agree with most of the views expressed on this topic. Rugby League has many great examples of players switching positions, Ellery Hanley played from Wing to Loose Forward. It's not Union where each position has a defined role. League allows players to switch positions much easier. The best example I can think of is the great Don Fox who started out as a scrum half and ended up playing prop!!!

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 9:46 pm  

The best example I can think of is the great Don Fox who started out as a scrum half and ended up playing prop!!![/quote]

Barnsley chops and and Tetley's bitter may have had something to do with that. Cheers just a bit of fun.

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:07 pm  

Starbug wrote:

We were our own worst enemy at times early in that 2 nd half, not sure we completed a set for 20 minutes with some daft plays ( running into touch 3 times, not to mention Penkys missed touchline kick )

Having said that your kids did inject some pace which caught us out at times, and much as I dont like Mr Wane, he should be congratulated for following your policy of blooding kids

A good game

, you never go to games, but maybe 2 a season.

Re: Stand Off : Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:17 pm  

terrykelly wrote:

:lol: , you never go to games, but maybe 2 a season.

And?

Re: Stand Off : Wed Jan 21, 2015 1:05 pm  

By no means do I think a player should only and always be the position they played growing up etc but I do think the development and coaching process can hamper a players development if they aren't given time to learn and develop the skills of a particular position.

In some cases it even requires a different physicality to play a different position.

In the case of Hanley, he developed his game in a different time, had first team experience before making a change, and lets face it Hanley was exceptional, so was the likes of Ruben Wiki who moved up from centre to prop or Luke Lewis, from wing to half to back row.

At times it works, at times its detrimental, I feel with Hughes, Powell and possibly Hampshire the development could have harmed the progression.

I hope Hughes gets a good run of games in the SR at Huddersfield, bulks up more and becomes a big strong confident runner of the ball living up to his potential.

Re: Stand Off : Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:02 pm  

All the best props that I can remember started off in a different position.
Brian McTigue was a centre.
Andy Platt was a loose forward.
Terry Clawson was a back row.
Peacock was a back row.
Kevin Ward was a back row.
Andy Farrell was a loose forward.
They all had speed which helped them to break the line whereas out and out props, apart from a few exceptions (Barry McDermot) weren't able to do this.
For example: Ricky Bibey, Gil Dudson and Terry O'Connor.
When a loose forward moves into a position where he needs more speed and agility, then I don't think it works.
I never liked seeing Farrell, Sculthorpe and Sinfield plaing stand-off.

Re: Stand Off : Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:57 pm  

Salty wrote:

All the best props that I can remember started off in a different position.
Brian McTigue was a centre.
Andy Platt was a loose forward.
Terry Clawson was a back row.
Peacock was a back row.
Kevin Ward was a back row.
Andy Farrell was a loose forward.
They all had speed which helped them to break the line whereas out and out props, apart from a few exceptions (Barry McDermot) weren't able to do this.
For example: Ricky Bibey, Gil Dudson and Terry O'Connor.
When a loose forward moves into a position where he needs more speed and agility, then I don't think it works.
I never liked seeing Farrell, Sculthorpe and Sinfield plaing stand-off.

Terry O'Connor in the same sentence as Bibey and Dudson....how rude