Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:09 am  

Salty wrote:

Last year our crowds went down but Wigan scored more tries. Therefore Wigan score more when there are fewer spectators.

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:12 am  

Salty wrote:

Last year our crowds went down but Wigan scored more tries. Therefore Wigan score more when there are fewer spectators.

In 2006 crowds went up and we scored less

But seriously I think those stats stand up quite well, but I think I will only be convinced after 3 years. Maybe Piggy does not set up and score tries directly but he has the whole team playing more efficiently in every area of attack which will obviously lead to more tries.

Thing is though you could also just as easily say we have scored more tries with Tomkins in the team and so on...

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:15 am  

Odemwingie wrote:

In 2006 crowds went up and we scored less

But seriously I think those stats stand up quite well, but I think I will only be convinced after 3 years. Maybe Piggy does not set up and score tries directly but he has the whole team playing more efficiently in every area of attack which will obviously lead to more tries.

Thing is though you could also just as easily say we have scored more tries with Tomkins in the team and so on...

Agreed but it was also the drop in tries when Higham arrived that makes it look a credible argument.
And don't forget in Barrett we also had the best halfback in Superleague for two of Highams three seasons.

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:25 am  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Agreed but it was also the drop in tries when Higham arrived that makes it look a credible argument.
And don't forget in Barrett we also had the best halfback in Superleague for two of Highams three seasons.

Well in conclusion, there must be loads of factors that contribute to this, I could give you a long list but Higham is not the only reason and I think you know that and people should not take those stats the wrong way. It is clearly one of many reasons behind our try scoring.

: Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:51 am  

i think its united us fans and shown people that us fans have and will always be brilliant.

Nobody can call us glory hunters and we have had a spirit that most clubs would love.

Its not been good for silverwear but has made us better in other ways and probably made the overall competition better.

: Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:20 pm  

Odemwingie wrote:

Supporters from Saints and Leeds especially, on the train home from the GF were all saying they think Wigan wil be the next team to dominate the league and cup for a few years. I personally think that with these young players and if we get the right people in being trained by the right people we are on to a winnner.

I believe that the reason so many people are excited about next season is because it will give us a real indication of what the next era of Wigan RL is going to be like, the new culture, playing style etc there are big changes at our club and this season will show us if they can work boht short term and long term.

Under IL I am confident that Wigan RL will once again be winning things and known nationwide as the best RL team.

I am really excited for next season and there will be a real buzz next year if we have some short term success straight away.

As a Saints fan I don't agree. Dominate is a strong word, and the only team that looks set to do that (rather, continue) is Leeds.

Tomkins is obviously a very good player and I think his bro' is a good player too.

But the problem remains in the pack in my opinion. Fielden is a shadow of the player he was, Fat Pa is effective but is not good enough for a team wishing to win and Coley has to work with the rest whats around him.

Losing Hock was a big blow.

Dont get me wrong, I think next season there will be some good rugby played by Wigan. Just think you are a tad over optimistic at present.

[DaveO]

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:36 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Riddell and Roberts are improvements on Higham and Calderwood. The only thing I would say about them is that they are taking quota spots up, which is a concern.

Riddell and Roberts are as average an overseas pair of recruits as you care to think. Regardless of how they compare to past players they are nothing special in their own right and were recruited under IL so that's all there is too it concerning the point I was making about recruitment.

You seem to be trying to make out they are some sort step up from past players so this is OK. It isn't because in absolute terms they are just the sort of players the club should not be recruiting.

Are they on higher salaries than the players they replaced, we don't know but as IL is more conservative with the salary cap money, then I doubt it.

I am not sure what the revelance of this comment is but they won't have come here for three and four years on peanuts. They will be being paid as senior professionals as they will be part of our top 25 earners list.

A club divides its salary cap of £1.6m between those 25 players so this pair are taking two of those slots up. They could be on £60K a season each and be the lowest paid in the top 25 they would still prevent us recruiting other players even if IL got them on the cheap.

Dave

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:38 pm  

Salty wrote:

Last year our crowds went down but Wigan scored more tries. Therefore Wigan score more when there are fewer spectators.

You've got a point there. 2008 vs Whitehaven 106-8 and only 3814 on

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 1:01 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Riddell and Roberts are as average an overseas pair of recruits as you care to think. Regardless of how they compare to past players they are nothing special in their own right and were recruited under IL so that's all there is too it concerning the point I was making about recruitment.


Dave

I know what you're saying, but shouldn't they be judged on their Wigan careers (however long that proves to be) rather than just one season? If we were to use that critera Lam, Richards and, I believe, one of your own favourite recruits, Craig Smith would all be judged as failures on their first years. As we know that was far from the whole picture!

Nevertheless I know where you're coming from. I'd rather see home grown talent sprinkled with the absolute cream from overseas too. Who knows wether the likes of Roberts or Riddell will go on to be considered good signings though? It could well be that one or both of them could flourish under the new regime. We simply don't know at this stage. It's not as though they have been disasterous signings in their first year, just not as good as we all would have liked.

Re: The "Noughties" - A wasted decade for Wigan RL : Thu Nov 12, 2009 1:09 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Riddell and Roberts are as average an overseas pair of recruits as you care to think. Regardless of how they compare to past players they are nothing special in their own right and were recruited under IL so that's all there is too it concerning the point I was making about recruitment.

You seem to be trying to make out they are some sort step up from past players so this is OK. It isn't because in absolute terms they are just the sort of players the club should not be recruiting.

I don't agree Dave.

Riddell and Roberts have not set the world alight, true, but they are definatly an improvement on what we had. Anyway, their fate will be decided this season. The 'settling in' excuse wears out pretty much now.