Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 9:53 am  

I believe when you examine the facts we have once again allowed ourselves to be 'kippered up' by a lack of due diligence.

We wanted to keep Connor but probably missed the fact that under the previous coach he was unsettled due to not getting his own position in the team which should have in all probability been full back.

The Giants made him an offer a good one based on the fact they thought no one could beat their offer as any other club would have had to pay out probably between £35k and £50k on top of his wages due to the RFL operating rules.

At this point no one seems to have clarified with the RFL what triggers this payment, the day he signs the contract or the day he starts a new contract at a new club.

Someone in all probability Jakes agent realises this and believes he can get a better deal from another club based on the fact there is a loophole in the regulations if the contract is delayed beyond the players 22nd birthday.

Hull and who can blame them as they are probably tight on salary cap for next year realise that paying Connor a few quid more and no compensation to the Giants is an excellent deal for them and this leads to the heads of agreement and 'has he signed saga.

Connor goes along with this and you can understand why as his pay is higher and keeps 'stum' not rejecting the Giants offer and signing for Hull partly for the money and partly as he was unsettled at this time.

Thewlis cries 'foul' but at this point he thinks he's covered under the operating rules but no one has checked with the RFL what triggers the compensation payment.

The RFL confirm he's a Hull player but Connor changes his mind and we face the stark possibility of paying to keep our own club trained player.

So who's 'kippered' us well I think there are three areas.

Ourselves for not checking with the RFL where we stand and not anticipating the impact of a delayed contract date if Connor joined another club. Lack of due dillegance

Connor and/or his agent for finding and along with Hull exploiting the loophole in RFL procedure. Jake would have to have known so I have no sympathy whatsoever for his predicament now.

The RFL for wishy washy operating rules and supporting the 'loophole' rather than the rules which were meant to stop this sort of thing happening.

I don't blame Hull whatsoever as any of the teams in the league including us would have done the same. The Kopjack incident was a prime example but again we appeared to lack due dillegance and ended up paying out.

I would very quickly confirm with the RFL which interpretation of the rules they are accepting although it appears it's the Hull one.

If this is the case then Connor wouldn't play again in front of Brierley, Simpson, Grix or Wood as he appears to be as culpable in this as anyone and showed scant regard for Huddersfield until it once again suited him.

The club then wants to overhaul its systems and procedures and possibly its people as mistakes of this magnitude shouldn't happen and this is not the first time.

We appear to have taken for granted we held all the right cards when we didn't but also if Jake had really wanted to stay he would surely have gone back to the club and said he had an alternative offer but he would have risked closing the loophole.

Sorry but he should go and hopefully we should finally learn our lesson about 'assumptions.'

Garden leave as suggested by another poster would be appropriate and Mr Thewlis needs to carry the other can.

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:05 am  

First, I'd seek outside advice from a HR professional. Not the incompetent ones the club has used in the past (ref Kopczak, Mason)

Then, subject to that advice, I'd take the following actions.

I'd take Jake Connor to one side and tell him that if he wants to play for the Giants he has until next weekend to get Hull to tear up the contract that he signed, but that the Giants won't pay a penny for a transfer fee to keep him. If he hasn't extricated himself from the situation by then I'd thank him for his contribution and tell him he will receive full pay until the end of his contract, but won't be selected to play for any Giants team or be able to attend any training sessions or club events. Have a good summer Jake and good luck in Hull.

Then I'd start disciplinary proceedings on incompetence grounds against Richard Thewlis with a view to getting him out of the business as soon as possible and as cheaply as possible.

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:19 am  

Yes it's a mess, and I'd expect someone to get carpeted for it

Obviously we as paying fans will be told nothing

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:20 am  

fartown since 1961 wrote:

I believe when you examine the facts we have once again allowed ourselves to be 'kippered up' by a lack of due diligence.

We wanted to keep Connor but probably missed the fact that under the previous coach he was unsettled due to not getting his own position in the team which should have in all probability been full back.

The Giants made him an offer a good one based on the fact they thought no one could beat their offer as any other club would have had to pay out probably between £35k and £50k on top of his wages due to the RFL operating rules.

At this point no one seems to have clarified with the RFL what triggers this payment, the day he signs the contract or the day he starts a new contract at a new club.

Someone in all probability Jakes agent realises this and believes he can get a better deal from another club based on the fact there is a loophole in the regulations if the contract is delayed beyond the players 22nd birthday.

Hull and who can blame them as they are probably tight on salary cap for next year realise that paying Connor a few quid more and no compensation to the Giants is an excellent deal for them and this leads to the heads of agreement and 'has he signed saga.

Connor goes along with this and you can understand why as his pay is higher and keeps 'stum' not rejecting the Giants offer and signing for Hull partly for the money and partly as he was unsettled at this time.

Thewlis cries 'foul' but at this point he thinks he's covered under the operating rules but no one has checked with the RFL what triggers the compensation payment.

The RFL confirm he's a Hull player but Connor changes his mind and we face the stark possibility of paying to keep our own club trained player.

So who's 'kippered' us well I think there are three areas.

Ourselves for not checking with the RFL where we stand and not anticipating the impact of a delayed contract date if Connor joined another club. Lack of due dillegance

Connor and/or his agent for finding and along with Hull exploiting the loophole in RFL procedure. Jake would have to have known so I have no sympathy whatsoever for his predicament now.

The RFL for wishy washy operating rules and supporting the 'loophole' rather than the rules which were meant to stop this sort of thing happening.

I don't blame Hull whatsoever as any of the teams in the league including us would have done the same. The Kopjack incident was a prime example but again we appeared to lack due dillegance and ended up paying out.

I would very quickly confirm with the RFL which interpretation of the rules they are accepting although it appears it's the Hull one.

If this is the case then Connor wouldn't play again in front of Brierley, Simpson, Grix or Wood as he appears to be as culpable in this as anyone and showed scant regard for Huddersfield until it once again suited him.

The club then wants to overhaul its systems and procedures and possibly its people as mistakes of this magnitude shouldn't happen and this is not the first time.

We appear to have taken for granted we held all the right cards when we didn't but also if Jake had really wanted to stay he would surely have gone back to the club and said he had an alternative offer but he would have risked closing the loophole.

Sorry but he should go and hopefully we should finally learn our lesson about 'assumptions.'

Garden leave as suggested by another poster would be appropriate and Mr Thewlis needs to carry the other can.

This is an Excellent post and sums up the situation perfectly.

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:50 am  

Yep agree

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:31 am  

the club offered connora low contract as baloo wanted rid of him, hull nearly tripled that contract

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:41 am  

Steve May wrote:

First, I'd seek outside advice from a HR professional. Not the incompetent ones the club has used in the past (ref Kopczak, Mason)

Then, subject to that advice, I'd take the following actions.

I'd take Jake Connor to one side and tell him that if he wants to play for the Giants he has until next weekend to get Hull to tear up the contract that he signed, but that the Giants won't pay a penny for a transfer fee to keep him. If he hasn't extricated himself from the situation by then I'd thank him for his contribution and tell him he will receive full pay until the end of his contract, but won't be selected to play for any Giants team or be able to attend any training sessions or club events. Have a good summer Jake and good luck in Hull.

Then I'd start disciplinary proceedings on incompetence grounds against Richard Thewlis with a view to getting him out of the business as soon as possible and as cheaply as possible.

Thewlis if he is the contract negotiator has 'low balled' Connors offer thinking the compensation clause is his safety net.

So he has cost us the asset that is Connors playing ability and the difference we will have to pay to replace him in monetary terms as it will be a lot more than a thirty grand a year upgrade to his current terms.

In this area I sympathise with Jake but would still get rid now.

The loss of such an asset and additional expense of replacing him is gross incompetence and the person responsible should never handle another contract negotiation again.

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 1:14 pm  

fartown since 1961 wrote:

Thewlis if he is the contract negotiator has 'low balled' Connors offer thinking the compensation clause is his safety net.

So he has cost us the asset that is Connors playing ability and the difference we will have to pay to replace him in monetary terms as it will be a lot more than a thirty grand a year upgrade to his current terms.

In this area I sympathise with Jake but would still get rid now.

The loss of such an asset and additional expense of replacing him is gross incompetence and the person responsible should never handle another contract negotiation again.

I have asked the question many times. Why has Mr Davy put up with this kind of incompetence for so long, If this was a one off I could understand but It's been going on for years now.

I don't know if this is Thewlis or not ( I have no inside info ) but it is somebody, and it goes on and on. You begin to start and think Does Mr Davy deserve all he get's, he is after all the man in charge. He finally had enough of PA ( thank heaven ) I can't work out why he is so lenient with his board.

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 1:20 pm  

so connor wants to stay now but its too late, deal been done!

oh well, still cant see him being in the team next season, first choice picks anyway

but we do need a squad

Re: Jake Connor who didn't do their homework ?? : Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:29 pm  

What a mess. I am no fan of Thewlis, how the man keeps his job. I think Ken is at the age that he does not want the hassle. Thewlis always tries to play a game of Bluff over contracts and then cries like a baby when he looses. What do the rest of the Directors think.? Think they are only there for the Ale.