Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:25 pm  

Leaguefan wrote:

Touchdown!!!


That's the way the game is going.

Certainly is, they might as well put the try into 2 categories. A dead certain placed try = 4 points, a dubious unsure try over the line = 2points (Or a pop shot at goal instead). I would also change the video ref time to judge at 1 minute, beyond the minute it goes back to the field ref decision, no further replays after that only at normal match speed from the field ref position.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 2:11 pm  

Mr Churchill wrote:

For a try to be scored, the Laws say that a player with the ball has to "place it on the ground with the hand" The "downward pressure" thing only comes in when the ball is loose in the in-goal area.

People seem to be selectively ignoring this. However it is correct. Downward pressure is irrelevant to the Hall try, that's to do with kick chases etc.

All that matters is did he place the ball down without losing control. The VR ruled he did as his fingers and/or wrist remained continuously in contact with the ball.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 2:47 pm  

The rule should be if the ball isn't grounded with at least 1 hand on the ball it isn't a try.

Or if the ground is what prevents the player losing control, like with the Hall try then it's a knock on.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:50 pm  

It's been a joke for a long time now. For the honesty of the game, that Hall try should have been wiped off. It is legal currently so honestly we can't argue. But it does need to change in the off season. I would suggest it has to be either the palm flat on the ball, or at the very least 4 fingers on top of it. One finger nail or a forearm just isn't enough to call down with pressure. Before that point they will have had the ball much more secure so clearly at some point they lost that amount of control to only be putting it down with their arm hairs.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:50 pm  

I don't like it but every rule has issues.
Where is the certain black and white line with control.
Where does the hand start and end?

There are lots of debating points.

For me sinfields 40/20 is far more telling he does not kick that and Saints are odds on to win

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:55 pm  

I think sgtwilko's comments are going over a few people's heads.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:15 pm  

Omar Little wrote:

People seem to be selectively ignoring this. However it is correct. Downward pressure is irrelevant to the Hall try, that's to do with kick chases etc.

All that matters is did he place the ball down without losing control. The VR ruled he did as his fingers and/or wrist remained continuously in contact with the ball.

No one is ignoring that, hence it being a thread about whether the rules as they are now should be looked at. As the rules stand you can reach to ground the ball, lose control and have it roll up the back of your hand and fall off the side and it would be a try technically. Ten years ago that kind of nonsense wasn't there, all the daft ones we've seen all season would have been disallowed. You should have to have control of the ball and create downward pressure.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:00 pm  

Think about it.

The rules now allow for black and white decisions to be made. If some part of the arm/hand/finger maintain contact with the ball until it touches the ground...try. No room for interpretation. Doesn't matter if it takes super zoom or if it's a finger tip.

As soon as you start bringing things like ''full control'' and ''downward pressure from hand'' that's when you will get dodgy decisions based on interpretation, because alot of these are inbetween and 50/50. But under current rules it's black and white and we are getting consistency in the decisions.

Because you can bet if you start bringing the above into the rulings people will moan even more due to inconsistency that will result.

People are idiots.

Re: Time to revisit ball grounding? : Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:14 pm  

FlexWheeler wrote:

Think about it.

The rules now allow for black and white decisions to be made. If some part of the arm/hand/finger maintain contact with the ball until it touches the ground...try. No room for interpretation. Doesn't matter if it takes super zoom or if it's a finger tip.

As soon as you start bringing things like ''full control'' and ''downward pressure from hand'' that's when you will get dodgy decisions based on interpretation, because alot of these are inbetween and 50/50. But under current rules it's black and white and we are getting consistency in the decisions.

Because you can bet if you start bringing the above into the rulings people will moan even more due to inconsistency that will result.

People are idiots.

You can't get more conclusive or black & white than a rule of "hand on the ball" when grounding for it to be a try. None of this wrist/forearm nonsense. If that ball is in your hand and rolls out and is only touching your wrist when it hits the ground, it's a knock on anywhere else on the pitch and it should be in goal too.