Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:17 pm  

Something that I have noticed recently (I'm sure others have too) is when a player stays down after a tackle when they reckon there was foul play and the ref hasn't given anything. Video ref gets involved, reviews it and they get a decision.

If I was a head coach I would be asking all of my players to do this at television games. I'm surprised it isn't more wide-spread.

But do you think that this is acceptable as long as the ref reaches the correct call?

I presume it is ok for the ref to do this but it would be interesting to know in what circumstances the ref can review something? I myself don't know the answer to that.

I would get rid of this and say that a ref cannot review potential foul play in a tackle. Stop the ridiculous stoppages and play acting.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:01 pm  

It always has being the case that the offcials react to the end result as opposed to what actually happened, a player stays down or feigns injury you're more likely to get a player sent off or carded.
That then puts more onus on the judiciary panel to back the referee's original decision, the amount of times you see a 'sending off sufficient' or similar with sin bin and that often covers up the fact neither should have happened.

However the flip side is you have situations officials barely act upon because a player got right back up or didn't react back - ablett's non reaction to being punched by Lee briers a couple of seasons ago in the cup for which Leeds got a penallty and Briers stayed on the pitch without even much of a warning. The rules themselves restrict how the referee can give out a suitable punishment at times.
Feigning injury to get a player sent off/sin binned is even lower than the vast majority of the illegal tackles themselves as it is deliberate and systematic cheating.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:13 pm  

It's terrible in the NRL, luckily not every game is televised over here so it's not as bad....yet.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:57 pm  

It comes down to the consistent use of the video ref. At the moment it's inconsistent hence players staying down.

Either restrict the use of the VR or let the VR constantly look at and advise the ref as play unfolds. Then you won't get players staying down. Ironically staying down "injured" backfired on LMS in the Cas v Saints game.

What would help hugely in my opinion is a "2nd ref". As they would be in a good position to view these incidents.

Aside from the staying down to get a penalty, I think the worse issue is when players fake injury to slow play. At a drop out its most noticeable. It's obviously difficult for the refs as player welfare should always be the top priority but I'm struggling to think of a recent genuine case of a player actually being injured in play (ie in front of the goal line) at a drop out.
This may be an issue for the RFL rather than refs, maybe they should look at repeat offenders and repeat offender clubs and punish them accordingly.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Fri Jun 26, 2015 4:39 am  

Video ref is killing the game IMO. As people state it's worse in Aus. This is a high speed tough collision sport. It doesn't need microanalysis down to the nano second and wait ages for something which ,at worst, is a 50/50 decision.
Let the match officials officiate. They will make mistakes, always have, but that's human nature. Players, coaches, fans, forum posters all do the same.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:33 am  

To be fair, they seem to have dealt with it in the NRL. The video referee is only consulted and can only give a penalty in these instances if it is a reportable offence. This has drastically reduced the amount of instances as players don't want to lose momentum of a quick play the ball and risk not getting the penalty.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:57 am  

As with most problems in the modern game, the problem is the inconsistency with which decisions are made and when the VR interacts with the onfield decision making. Last night was a case in point.

VR tells Bentham that there was foul play (crusher tackle) on the Hull KR player late on, and the penalty was awarded when Bentham hadn't seen anything wrong initially. However, earlier in the game the on field decision was blatantly incorrect (knock on by Inu / steal by Welham that lead to the first try) and the VR didn't get involved and correct that one.

Either the video referee is allowed to interact in "real time" with the onfield referee, and they do so for ALL decisions - or they are only to be used for try/no try decisions (as was the initial remit of the VR when they were introduced).

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:44 am  

Catalan are one of the worst, Henderson, will go down, every game, especially if they are winning, Price was as bad, Escare is doing it now, Tomkins milked every tackle, but cleaned his act up after fans complaned, but you are right its getting worse, very poor.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:44 am  

Catalan are one of the worst, Henderson, will go down, every game, especially if they are winning, Price was as bad, Escare is doing it now, Tomkins milked every tackle, but cleaned his act up after fans complaned, but you are right its getting worse, very poor.

Re: Play acting / diving - needs to stop? : Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:10 pm  

You know, sometimes I wonder whether you guys would prefer a game in which NOTHING worth talking about happens at all.

A few players turn on the customary amateur dramatics in a hamfisted attempt to run down the clock and suddenly we need to eradicate such entirely from the game.

This might come as a shock to many of you but ... controversy is the life-blood of the game. Anyone who believes otherwise should instantly be re-directed to the infamous "Joynt Fell Over" thread which (along with the equally infamous "explaining the finer points of the momentum rule to John Senior" epic) needed a re-write of the PHPBB software to cope with its colossal size and duration.

Why in GOD'S NAME would we want to eradicate villainous cheatery from the game when it clearly gives everyone something to bellyache/chortle over on a Monday morning?

Half of you love to moan like old women. And you know it.

On the other hand I do think there are aspects of the game which really do need addressing. Personally I'm sick to the back teeth of half-backs putting snow on the ball on fifth tackle, hoisting it high to the flanks or chipping it into the in-goal looking for a lucky re-bound or a repeat set. I think it's a thoroughly negative style of play which is primarily aimed at forcing (expensive) mistakes. Back in the 80s we used to take the mickey out of the Rugger Buggers because they were always kicking. Our mantra was "Rugby League players run and pass with the ball". Nowadays we're as bad as they are - in not WORSE.

There's something very wrong with the game when a beautiful piece of skill gets you no more points than a scrambled finger-tip touched ball which has ricocheted off the post, bounced up off the full-back's face and then deflected off someone's ankle.

We're now at the point where some teams are more dangerous kicking the ball than running it. They certainly seem to put more effort into kicking patterns than actual handling skill.

And before anyone pitches in with the usual "Kicking is a skill, too!" - I'll point you to Wayne Bennett who for years and years didn't consider tries scored from kicks as worthy of recognition. And he wasn't alone. Chris Anderson took a similarly dim view of kicks. I remember interviewing him when he was Australia coach over here and his face contorted in his customary "bulldog chewing a wasp" way when I mentioned a try that GB had scored. "That's not Rugby League" was his curt response.

Even kicking for an extra set gets on my nerves. I mean, if you couldn't get over the line on the previous five tackles why should you deserve another shot dribbling it over the line and trapping the man in goal? For me the attacking side has all the advantages in such a position because it's very, very difficult for the receiver to clear the in-goal with 13 guys bearing down on him. I guess what I'm saying is the payoff is too great for comparatively little effort.

One of the discussions on the Saints site mentions the fact that wingers are becoming bigger and bigger precisely because of this negative "play for a mistake" tactic. Like English football in the stagnant eighties players are being picked less because they are skillful and more because they are the tallest guy in the side. This can't be right.

I'm not saying we should do away with all kicking. But I do think we need to look at reducing the rewards for kicking. I agree with Anderson & Bennett in that it is too tied up with luck and depressingly negative. Even the best players find it impossible to cope with the chaotic behavior of a ball caught by a rogue gust of wind. Time and time again you see such being slaughtered for blowing a catch (even losing the game) which is all but impossible to make whilst the try-scorer is labelled a hero despite the fact that he did little more than put himself in the vicinity where he then lucked out with the ball popping up right into his hands.

Surely I'm not the only person who thinks this? Surely?