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Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:31 pm
Posted by JEAN CAPDOUZE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:31 pm
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musson wrote:
I'd like to think The cook islands can field an improved competitive side, we need another nation to come through to fill the final spot

4 leagues of 4 with the top going through has to be the goal


We don't need the Cook Islands in the World Cup. The country has a population of 19,000 (which makes it smaller than Leigh) and no domestic competition.

We should be thinking of adding Serbia, which has a population of nearly 9 million, a domestic competition, and a few heritage players in Australia. Next perhaps another European country which has a domestic competition, or Canada, to fill the 16th spot.
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Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:43 pm
Posted by JEAN CAPDOUZE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:43 pm
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vastman wrote:
GB/England have always made beating 'lesser' teams hard work. Why I don't know. However they are infinitely superior in every facet of the game than PNG. As I say they will make hard work of it but they will do it easily in the end.




This is not true. Except for the wingers, PNG has superior outside backs and halves to England, and even the PNG wingers are very good and will be competitive.
It is only in the forwards where England is superior to PNG (except for hooker), and England will depend on its forwards making many yards and defending well in order to win.
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Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:40 am
Posted by Huddersfield1895 on Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:40 am
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Get the ball out to our wingers as the size of them will trouble anyone.
Start with Hodgeson as Hooker and then bring Roby on after about 30 minutes as his running from dummy half will cause them nightmares.
Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:01 am
Posted by Shifty Cat on Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:01 am
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JEAN CAPDOUZE wrote:
This is not true. Except for the wingers, PNG has superior outside backs and halves to England, and even the PNG wingers are very good and will be competitive.
It is only in the forwards where England is superior to PNG (except for hooker), and England will depend on its forwards making many yards and defending well in order to win.

:D Really? I know you like to talk Engand down and every other side up. Also even though a few players haven't hit their straps, you can't surely dismiss a Daly M winning five-eight Widdop, who's played well for England & this seasons SL Man of Steel Luke Gale, for PNG's Halfs. IMO the only PNG back I'd have in the England team is Nene Macdonald. Also are you saying Watkins for example wouldn't be in the PNG starting 13, or do think Ottio is a better player.

There's also there's more facets to the game than individual players, there's experience both individually and collectively from playing in big International Comps but also at a high level in the NRL and SL. There's the Coaching structures, we're we've got one of the best ever in that regard, whatever you may think of him, plus other tanglible and intangible facets.
Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:28 pm
Posted by vastman on Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:28 pm
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JEAN CAPDOUZE wrote:
This is not true. Except for the wingers, PNG has superior outside backs and halves to England, and even the PNG wingers are very good and will be competitive.
It is only in the forwards where England is superior to PNG (except for hooker), and England will depend on its forwards making many yards and defending well in order to win.


Of course it's true you silly person.
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Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:46 pm
Posted by RoyBoy29 on Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:46 pm
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JEAN CAPDOUZE wrote:
We don't need the Cook Islands in the World Cup. The country has a population of 19,000 (which makes it smaller than Leigh) and no domestic competition.

We should be thinking of adding Serbia, which has a population of nearly 9 million, a domestic competition, and a few heritage players in Australia. Next perhaps another European country which has a domestic competition, or Canada, to fill the 16th spot.



And?, your point is
Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:10 pm
Posted by JEAN CAPDOUZE on Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:10 pm
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Shifty Cat wrote:
:D Really? I know you like to talk Engand down and every other side up. Also even though a few players haven't hit their straps, you can't surely dismiss a Daly M winning five-eight Widdop, who's played well for England & this seasons SL Man of Steel Luke Gale, for PNG's Halfs. IMO the only PNG back I'd have in the England team is Nene Macdonald. Also are you saying Watkins for example wouldn't be in the PNG starting 13, or do think Ottio is a better player.

There's also there's more facets to the game than individual players, there's experience both individually and collectively from playing in big International Comps but also at a high level in the NRL and SL. There's the Coaching structures, we're we've got one of the best ever in that regard, whatever you may think of him, plus other tanglible and intangible facets.


I don't talk England down. I think that England has a strong team. But so does PNG. And I think that England can win, but not easily because of the PNG back line firepower.

I don't know which position Gareth Widdop will play. But if it is full back then he is good but not better than speedster David Mead. I would put those two as roughly equal.

As far as half backs go Luke Gale has been outperformed by the PNG halves -- all three of them.

Nene Macdonald is the best centre of any in either team. Kato Ottio is better than Bateman and probably Percival, though we will see for sure next Sunday..
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Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:24 pm
Posted by HXSparky on Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:24 pm
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JEAN CAPDOUZE wrote:
We don't need the Cook Islands in the World Cup. The country has a population of 19,000 (which makes it smaller than Leigh) and no domestic competition.

We should be thinking of adding Serbia, which has a population of nearly 9 million, a domestic competition, and a few heritage players in Australia. Next perhaps another European country which has a domestic competition, or Canada, to fill the 16th spot.


LOL. Canada would be starting well behind USA in establishing a national team. USA managed to score 12 points whilst leaking 168 in this competition. As to whether the Cook Islands are a valid addition, that's also doubtful. In terms of Serbia, they apparently have around 1000 registered players, but most of those are juniors, so probably a few years before they're in a position to take a place on the world stage. It does seem that they making progress though.
Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:31 pm
Posted by HXSparky on Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:31 pm
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Back to the original post, England will need to be at their best (defensively) to beat Tonga.
Re: Can England beat Tonga?
Post Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:39 am
Posted by BrisbaneRhino on Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:39 am
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I think people are getting a bit overexcited by Tonga. NZ were vastly superior for the first 40 minutes against them, and threw the game away by basically not playing for most of the second half. Momentum is huge in RL, and really hard to get back once a team starts coasting. England had the same problem vs France. Put it this way, I expect NZ would beat Tonga 9 times out of 10 and Australia wouldn't be fazed by the idea of playing them at all.

Tonga will start like a house on fire through Fifita and Taumalolo. The key will be to hold them for the first 20 minutes - solid defence and playing for position. Let those guys make some damaging runs near their own line.
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