Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 11:48 am  

This is just pure devil's advocate

Now, I see a lot of people going on about Marc Green and how if he somehow manages to hold on to control of the Bulls then they'll stop going or some such nonsense.

However, I don't see exactly WHY people have a problem with him. Yes, the back end of the season where there were money issues was a problem especially with him being on holiday during this time rather than at the club, but really what did people expect him to do if he WAS at the club and not on holiday that he couldn't do being out of the country. It's 2016 people, we have the internet which means we can hold meetings and such like with people from around the world from the comfort of our own toilets if we so chose.

So what else has Mark Green done wrong? He himself was the first to admit he knew nothing about RL or running a club like this, but he gave it a go anyway. He could have gone "turn off the lights, sell of the assets, I want back the money I loaned the club and sod the lot of you". He had Ferres appointed and hired Lowes as head coach (that second one, I grant you was a bad call given Lowes coaching record and was clearly done more on the back of 'this will get the fans onside' rather than practical rugby considerations). But Ferres was given the recommendation/job on the word of the RFL and to be fair to him he didn't do THAT bad a job. Between them, the BOD at the Bulls managed to get back some good feeling to the club following the relegation and following a season where we could barely get 17 players on the pitch, managed to put together what looked a strong team with good depth. Bad additional signings and a failure to properly rotate the squad to get the best out of them is clearly a coaching issue rather than a board one - again Lowes seems to have dodged the flack on the failed signings under his reign and that has hit Ferres despite the claims that although Ferres might have signed the players, he was doing so at Lowes' request.

Green has also never actually been that dishonest about the club's financial state. He was quoted as saying that there wasn't some big pot of money to keep the club going and that if the fans wanted to see the club stay full time that they would need to be the ones putting their hands in their pocket and paying the club's way. Admittedly, the club did a lot of complaining about the fans drinking in pubs outside the ground prior to kick off instead of inside, but I think that the club could have done more to encourage people to come in early and spend their cash at the club's bars. Better drinks, more seating - lets face it how much are 100 plastic patio chairs and a couple of tables to go with them and they could have easily been put out behind the sticks at the Rooley Lane end of the ground that didn't get much traffic through the season and could have been put to better use as a beer garden.

So, apart from a few growing pains as Mr Green learned what it takes to run a rugby club, what did he actually do that was so wrong that people are so vehemently against his regaining of the club?

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 11:50 am  

We need him like a fart in a space suit.

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 12:12 pm  

bowlingboy wrote:

We need him like a fart in a space suit.

See, that's my point. People are happy to send the blame his way, but never seem to actually be able to justify it.

[Pumpetypump]

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 12:34 pm  

I have apathy for him. I have apathy for any small businessman playing white Knight. They might mean well but for our club they are pointless.

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 1:45 pm  

I'm not someone who wouldn't go back but I think the main thing that may mickey people off is getting the club back by dodging the HMRC bill. Tax dodging.

Also, it took me a long time to realise, and I'm sure FA will come and condescend the hell out of this if it is wrong but there may have been a heck of a price hike for the fans:

It cost me approx. £230 to sit down in 2014 and the same again in 2015 and 2016 to stand up and seats were more expensive (unsure of the difference), anyway prices went up.

But if these were memberships and were a ploy to avoid VAT, then the price went up and the club kept the VAT rate too. That's a little underhand IMO.

And the only vote we got was to rename the "Northern Terrace" last season.

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 1:54 pm  

While I don't particularly blame him (running a RL club must be a financial black hole,) he did (at least for the first year) state he was going to be open and honest with the fans. And from what I've seen he certainly hasn't done that.

In fact he has told us things we wanted to hear: Promotion, owning Odsal again, "I will not put us into administration", "...the Bulls will be a well run business...", countless winding up petitions, "Business as usual" says Green from Ibiza, Free SL tickets when we get promoted next year(!), etc without actually having the means to deliver that. In fact, from what we can see it looks like its been falling apart for months, but Mr Green has not been up-front and honest with the fans.
In fact he seems to have done the opposite and hidden these facts from us.


I can understand people losing faith in him, and them not wanting him back in charge, I mean, he has hoodwinked us despite his best intentions. And you would think that looking at the Bulls recent history with such owners this is the opposite of what to do if you want to maintain the fans faith in you.

However, I reckon the next owner will be completely honest with us, and will never let us down. We may even get Steve Ferres back!

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 2:00 pm  

Fr13daY wrote:

While I don't particularly blame him (running a RL club must be a financial black hole,) he did (at least for the first year) state he was going to be open and honest with the fans. And from what I've seen he certainly hasn't done that.

In fact he has told us things we wanted to hear: Promotion, owning Odsal again, "I will not put us into administration", "...the Bulls will be a well run business...", countless winding up petitions, "Business as usual" says Green from Ibiza, Free SL tickets when we get promoted next year(!), etc without actually having the means to deliver that. In fact, from what we can see it looks like its been falling apart for months, but Mr Green has not been up-front and honest with the fans.
In fact he seems to have done the opposite and hidden these facts from us.


I can understand people losing faith in him, and them not wanting him back in charge, I mean, he has hoodwinked us despite his best intentions. And you would think that looking at the Bulls recent history with such owners this is the opposite of what to do if you want to maintain the fans faith in you.

I don't think that's a million miles away from where I am with it.

Will I sack off supporting the club if Green gets it back? No. Will I be happy about him getting it again? Also no. Will I ever trust anything he says after he has clearly lied this year? The pattern continues, no.

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:12 pm  

hindle xiii wrote:

I'm not someone who wouldn't go back but I think the main thing that may mickey people off is getting the club back by dodging the HMRC bill. Tax dodging.

Also, it took me a long time to realise, and I'm sure FA will come and condescend the hell out of this if it is wrong but there may have been a heck of a price hike for the fans:

It cost me approx. £230 to sit down in 2014 and the same again in 2015 and 2016 to stand up and seats were more expensive (unsure of the difference), anyway prices went up.

But if these were memberships and were a ploy to avoid VAT, then the price went up and the club kept the VAT rate too. That's a little underhand IMO.

And the only vote we got was to rename the "Northern Terrace" last season.

I'm less bothered about hmrc not getting the VAT as I am about not giving someone - that worked for free in the past - the proper pay off. Causing the club more bad press and costing thousands more than it should have. I'm also more bothered about people not getting paid on time which is something I feel really strongly about.

Screw the tax man if hmrc are that bothered then they should do something about the billions avoided by the super rich

But that's just my opinion.

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 4:23 pm  

The problem is that once Marc Green had arrived at the club with many and repeated promises of 'I'm an honest guy' and 'I'll always be open with fans' (thus trying to distinguish himself from what came before) he had to then deliver on that promise.

And the truth is that he hasn't. As time has gone on he has become more and more opaque. There have been countless WUPs - usually explained - if at all - as some sort of 'error'. The regular fans forums and events (remember the heady days of the event at Cedar Court and that evening in a big marquee at Odsal?) have been discontinued. We have seen key staff depart such as Parker, Ferres, RHP and Longo without any explanation (or replacement, for that matter).

And, worst of all, we have seen more and more blame attached to the fans. We didn't buy enough Season Tickets. We dared to drink beer in the pub instead of at Osdal. We didn't use the price comparison site to choose our electricity supplier. We drove Ferres away etc etc.

Once the owner starts playing that game, they are on a slippery slope (e.g Caisley)

I'm one of those who wouldn't be going if Green gets the club again. He's been entirely dishonest and disingenuous with the loyal supporters - whilst delivering a product that has been, for the most part, extremely sub-standard. And that's before we start on his tax dodging and non-payment to suppliers.

I just wouldn't feel comfortable going with him in charge. Let's face it, it would only be a matter of time before we'd be back in Administration again as he obviously doesn't have any money...

Re: Marc Green - What has he ever done for us? : Sat Nov 26, 2016 5:30 pm  

Pumpetypump wrote:

I have apathy for him. I have apathy for any small businessman playing white Knight. They might mean well but for our club they are pointless.

Did you mean "empathy" or was that a Freudian Slip?