Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:08 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

I am not saying Leeds should sign him, but he is far better than what is given credit for on here. Would be a huge improvement on what we have behind Ward and Ablett.

I am basing my opinion upon having watched him against us but he cannot defend at all. In our games we have targeted him with great success.

Frankly, based upon attitude and application this season I would prefer Delaney and Keinhorst.

If by some miracle he could get his career back on track then lets see but right now I don't see why Leeds would want or need to take the risk with him. Someone else might and it might pay off. Good luck to them and him.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:13 pm  

G1 wrote:

I am basing my opinion upon having watched him against us but he cannot defend at all. In our games we have targeted him with great success.

Frankly, based upon attitude and application this season I would prefer Delaney and Keinhorst.

If by some miracle he could get his career back on track then lets see but right now I don't see why Leeds would want or need to take the risk with him. Someone else might and it might pay off. Good luck to them and him.

I totally agree. He had his chance and blew it. If he could turn it around I'd be impressed, but I can't see it, and like you say, the risk is too great for Leeds to be interested.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:30 pm  

G1 wrote:

I am basing my opinion upon having watched him against us but he cannot defend at all. In our games we have targeted him with great success.

Frankly, based upon attitude and application this season I would prefer Delaney and Keinhorst.

If by some miracle he could get his career back on track then lets see but right now I don't see why Leeds would want or need to take the risk with him. Someone else might and it might pay off. Good luck to them and him.

I actually said behind Ward and Ablett, but if you compare to Ablett who I think has been poor defensively it kind of tells a different story. Ablett has played 31 super league games and made 772 tackles (average 25 per match), and missed 71 tackles (8.43% of the tackles he attempts). Westerman has played 22 Super League games and made 696 tackles (average 32 per match) and missed 41 tackles (5.5% of the tackles he attempts). Certainly a more impressive defensive effort than Ablett this year.

Compare to a good defender in Delaney who has played 21 super league games and made 573 tackles (average 27 per match), and missed 43 tackles (6.98% of the tackles he attempts).

I know that early season game against Hull, Westerman was poor defensively, but the cup game which isn't included in those stats above he made 50 tackles in the match and one miss. Those are not the stats of someone who can not defend. Still doesn't mean we should be signing like, but just stating the position.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:53 pm  

I'm with Gotcha on this one. (Nice to see you having a regard for stats Gotcha )

Westerman had a lot of promise at Cas and I took a look at his stats for 2014 where he was 3rd highest tackler with 916 3rd highest number of carries with 488 (only JP and Roby ahead of him and he was in front of Chris Hill) He also had reasonable stats for Busts, Metres and 41 Offloads (8th. only Leeds player above him was JP with 49)

So it doesn't look like a lack of ability/technique/workrate and so more likely his drop in form is down to motivation/fitness and if so we have the coach to solve that problem. With Achurch on his way and injury doubts over JJB and Delaney it could be a prudent signing if not too expensive. Under the new structure we need strength in depth.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:03 pm  

Can't say as I'm fussed about Westerman but I recognise he has some potential/talent. I'd rather we put the effort into developing in house personally if at all possible.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:05 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

I actually said behind Ward and Ablett,.

I know, which I why I said I prefer Delaney and keinhorst as they are, presumably, the second rowers behind Ward and Ablett.

but if you compare to Ablett

There's no comparison. He's not fit to lace Ablett's boots, even on what has been a down year for Ablett.

That is based upon the eye test. I'm not interested in statistics.

I'm sure he has upside and potential, I just don't see that we need to be the ones to help him possibly try and achieve it. If the rumours are true and we do sign him I hope that is exactly what we do but I'm not keen at all.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:48 pm  

He would be an improvement on what we have, that is true. I just have doubts about his mentality. I've never seen him perform well in an important, intense game.

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 5:56 pm  

Hetherington signs players who are decent people. Westerman is an idiot. Unprofessional, LOVES a drinks, hangs round on street corners with his mates Richard Owen and co in their Range Rovers in Ferry Fryston. Source? I've seen it!

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:01 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

That's not true actually. He was a good lad working hard making his way at Cas, then got in with the wrong ones. Not too dissimilar to Zak's path. Made a fool of himself, went to Hull, and has worked hard improving himself. Had two very good years at Hull and fell out with Radford this season, and wants out.

I am not saying Leeds should sign him, but he is far better than what is given credit for on here. Would be a huge improvement on what we have behind Ward and Ablett.

coach at cas told me he was brilliant and had the world at his feet "but then met that c*nt chase". his exact words.


I think with a professional club and better players he will thrive

Re: Who will wear the 8,9,10 and 13 jerseys in 2016? : Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:37 pm  

Balls to it, I'm going to stick my neck out here and say I'd be delighted for us to sign a genuine loose forward who runs, passes and can kick just like Westerman. I hate seeing props play at 13 because coaches don't trust the impact of their 8 & 10 and in Galloway, Cuthbertson, Garbutt and Singleton/Baldwinson were alright for props. If Westerman doesn't come then I can live with JJB, Ablett and Delaney in the second row/sub and Ward at 13. I think it's a bit strange that a few are very critical of Westermans social habits and yet no mention of the sort of behaviour that has resulted in Falloon's charges in Australia.